ipod 5g video controls

[bblackmoor]

[Edit: I stupidly did not realize that the Evil G build may have modified the controls, making this thread useless. Ignore this thread. I will create a new one when or if the issue I am talking about is present in a standard build. -- bblackmoor]

I am a new Rockbox user. I am very impressed with it, and enormously grateful for the work that went (and goes) into it.

However, I am having some difficulty getting accustomed to the user interface. This might be because I am using an iPod (I previously used a Zen Touch, which has a user interface that works more the way I expect). Here is what is throwing me:

Sometimes "Select" is used to select, and sometimes "Next" [>>] is used to select.

Sometimes "Menu" is used to access the menu, and sometimes "Select" is used to access the menu.

Sometimes "Previous" [<<] is used to navigate to the previous screen, sometimes the "Menu" button is used to access the previous screen.

I can never remember which is which in what circumstances, so I spend a lot of time flipping back and forth through menus, which gets a bit tiresome.

I assume that this inconsistency is caused by trying to map the Rockbox interface to the iPod's wonky "click wheel". I am wondering if there is a patch for the iPod so that selecting, accessing the menu, and going back to the previous screen are each always reached by the "Select", "Menu", and "Previous" buttons, respectively.


Any tips?

[Febs]

Can you give some examples?  As far as I know, "Menu" is always used to access the Menu.  "Select" is used only to access context-specific menus.

[Llorean]

What screen is "Select" the one that accesses the menu, and which ones does "Right" work but "Select" does not, for selecting something?

I think part of the problem may be that in many screens both Right and Select can choose something, and Left and Menu can both exit, rather than sometimes it being one, and sometimes it being the other.

But a list of specific screens where this is a problem could help a lot.

[bblackmoor]

[Edit: I stupidly did not realize that the Evil G build may have modified the controls, making this thread useless. Ignore this thread. I will create a new one when or if the issue I am talking about is present in a standard build. -- bblackmoor]

But a list of specific screens where this is a problem could help a lot.

"Problem" is probably too strong a word. Sooner or later, I can get to whatever I am looking for, simply by trial and error or by trying to figure it out from the manual. And chances are that it all made sense to whomever mapped the Rockbox commands to the iPod's "click wheel". Or maybe it was the best they felt they could do at the time, given the device's available controls.

I am kind of surprised that I would need to go through and give specific examples, though. I assumed that anyone else using an iPod would have noticed what I am talking about, as it's pretty hard to miss (in fact, I thought there was a good chance someone had already written a patch to address it). But I will go through later today or this evening and go through the various screens and write up which button does what. I would like to be helpful.

[bblackmoor]

[Edit: I stupidly did not realize that the Evil G build may have modified the controls, making this thread useless. Ignore this thread. I will create a new one when or if the issue I am talking about is present in a standard build. -- bblackmoor]

Okay, here are two examples where the button one pushes to perform a task (select, menu, next, previous) is not the same as the button labeled for that task. I hope this is helpful. Note that these are just a couple of typical examples. Pretty much every screen on the iPod 5g Video has unexpected button behavior of this sort.

The root menu (highlighted item is "Files"):

button	expected	actual
Select	enter Files menu	nothing
Select (held)	?	"Files" settings
Menu	nothing (already at root menu)	changes to "Now Playing" screen
Menu (held)	context menu?	nothing
Next	nothing	enter Files menu
Next (held)	?	nothing
Previous	nothing	nothing
Previous (held)	?	nothing

The "Files" settings menu, found by Select+hold on Files in the root menu (the highlighted item is "Sort Case Sensitive"):

button	expected	actual
Select	view/edit "Sort Case Sensitive" settings	nothing
Select (held)	?	nothing
Menu	shows parent (root) menu	shows parent (root) menu
Menu (held)	context menu?	nothing
Next	nothing	view/edit "Sort Case Sensitive" settings
Next (held)	?	nothing
Previous	shows previous screen (root menu)	shows previous screen (root menu)
Previous (held)	?	nothing

I was going to list the commands when navigating the file system, but I am running an Evil G build which modifies some of those commands, and I don't have the time at the moment to go through the process of switching to the standard build, documenting the commands, and then switching back. I may do that later, if you think it would be helpful.

The gist of this, though, is that one would reasonably expect the select button to select, the menu button to bring up the menu, etc., and on the iPod, this is not consistently the case. It is sometimes the case, but sometimes it isn't, and short of carrying the Rockbox manual around or memorizing the layout of every screen (which I suppose will happen eventually), there is some trial and error involved in controlling Rockbox on an iPod 5g Video.

To recap, if someone knows of a patch which makes the controls on an iPod consistent, that would be great. If not, if someone plans to work on one, I will volunteer my time to go through every screen and document what it currently does, along with what it ought to do (in my opinion, of course) based on how the buttons are labeled. And if no one ever works on it, well, maybe this thread will help some future Rockbox iPod user who's wondering if they're the only one who can't select something by pressing the "Select" button.

[Llorean]

You're telling me you're complaining about the button mappings, when you're using a build that modifies them? Did you even take a moment to VERIFY your findings with an official build? Because I'll tell you, those button mappings you've listed don't match the official build.

I'm somewhat frustrated that you've taken all this time with something that wouldn't have been nearly the same discussion if you'd just followed the forum guidelines. Please don't assume that patched builds don't change things just because they don't clearly state that they do. We require that you be talking about an official build for a reason.

[bblackmoor]

[Edit: I stupidly did not realize that the Evil G build may have modified the controls, making this thread useless. Ignore this thread. I will create a new one when or if the issue I am talking about is present in a standard build. -- bblackmoor]

Did you even take a moment to VERIFY your findings with an official build?

I started with an official build, and I didn't think that this build altered what I was asking about. But I guess it's entirely possible that it did. I will revert to a standard build and see what kind of effect that has, and report my findings.

It wasn't my intention to waste anyone's time. I'm sorry for making such an obvious newbie mistake. Mea culpa.