Rockbox Technical Forums

Support and General Use => User Interface and Voice => Topic started by: jtorque on May 24, 2007, 07:10:00 PM

Title: Artist/Song Order
Post by: jtorque on May 24, 2007, 07:10:00 PM
Maybe I am overlooking something here, but I have read the manual and cannot seem to find an answer to this. When looking at the artist or song list, most of the songs are in alphabetic order. Music with accents in the name, however, appear at the very bottom of the list instead of where it seems like they should likely fit into the list. The group "Änglagård," for example, should be near the top of the artist list instead of the bottom. Is there any way to correct this?

I must say that I am very impressed by the progress that has been made by Rockbox. I truly appreciate the efforts everyone has put forth to make such a great system.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Llorean on May 24, 2007, 07:12:28 PM
The problem is that traditional simple alphabetical sorting algorithms don't tend to take into account accented characters, which actually show up in a completely different place in the standard character list. An algorithm to take this into account would in the end be significantly more complex, unfortunately.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: pixelma on May 24, 2007, 10:08:38 PM
Additionally these accented characters get sorted differently in different languages.

You provided a nice example: "Änglagård" (which I assume is a swedish name). In the swedish alphabet, the accented characters follow the non accented characters. The group starting with an "Ä" would be found correctly after the "Z". In other languages it would be sorted along the "A".
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Llorean on May 24, 2007, 10:11:29 PM
Of course the TSOP (and equivalent tags) would allow you to pick exactly how you wanted these included in the sort without every seeing whatever slightly incorrect name you used to put them there. ;)
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: AlexP on May 25, 2007, 03:31:12 AM
Of course the TSOP (and equivalent tags) would allow you to pick exactly how you wanted these included in the sort without every seeing whatever slightly incorrect name you used to put them there.

I had been trying to stay out of this argument, as enough people were already pointing out to lalittle why his idea was flawed, but this is yet another excellent point towards using TSOP. :)
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Mikerman on May 25, 2007, 11:45:36 AM
TSOP = ?

Quote
Acronym    Definition
TSOP   Tactical Standing Operating Procedure
TSOP   The Sound Of Philadelphia
TSOP   The Speed of Pain (Marilyn Manson song)
TSOP   Thin Small-Outline Package

http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/TSOP
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: DefineByte on May 25, 2007, 11:49:58 AM
It's the performer sort order frame in ID3v2.4. It's used instead of the performer tag for sorting (if you so desire).
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Llorean on May 25, 2007, 12:51:48 PM
Sorry, I'm using it as shorthand to mean "TSOP and other equivalent tags."

Basically, TSOP, TSOA, TSOT for ID3v2.4, and a variety of other tags in other standards that perform indentical function. Basically, if you want to display one name for the Artist, Album, or Title, but want it to be in a place in the sort order that is different from where the display name is, you would write something different in the sort-order tag than what is displayed, and whatever program is sorting puts it in the place appropriate to the TSO tag rather than the normal tag.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Mikerman on May 25, 2007, 04:59:01 PM
Ah, got it--like a tag which could result in the beginning "The" to appear in the title display list, but alphabetize according to the next word.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Llorean on May 25, 2007, 05:05:25 PM
Basically, for Artist, Album, and Title, there are two tags. One to show, and one to use when sorting.

You'd show "The Beatles", but the sorting tag would have in it "Beatles, The" instead.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: jtorque on May 26, 2007, 12:17:16 AM
If that's something that I can correct in my audio files, perfect. Thank you very much.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: Llorean on May 26, 2007, 12:20:13 AM
It's not something you can correct yet, unfortunately. Someone needs to implement it.
Title: Re: Artist/Song Order
Post by: bblackmoor on June 11, 2007, 07:14:32 PM
Basically, TSOP, TSOA, TSOT for ID3v2.4, and a variety of other tags in other standards that perform indentical function. Basically, if you want to display one name for the Artist, Album, or Title, but want it to be in a place in the sort order that is different from where the display name is, you would write something different in the sort-order tag than what is displayed, and whatever program is sorting puts it in the place appropriate to the TSO tag rather than the normal tag.

Wow, that's a great idea. I had pretty much resigned myself finding half of my artists/albums under "The". :)