Rockbox Technical Forums
Support and General Use => Hardware => Topic started by: watchpocket on July 28, 2006, 03:24:56 AM
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What is to be made of the complete mystery surrounding the phenomenon of a recent batch of h140s from OutletMP3 (including mine, Zeke's, WrimWramWrom's and others' as reported here) that install RB only to freeze at "Result: 0" just before the RB splash screen would appear?
I performed the upgrade / install several times slowly, soberly and with utmost attention to detail. A friend has two h140s & he copied the install and files from his first to his second w/ no problems. Did exactly the same w/ mine only to get "Result: 0" again.
How, why is this happening? What can be done? It appears not to be a hardware issue as "Result: 0" indicates successful install. Is it in fact a failure of the "rockbox.iriver" file? Or . . . or what?
Is this issue destined to remain unfathomed? I would surely hope not, given the active preparations for a new RB 3.0. My current prospects -- and those of all others w/ this problem, afaict -- are to return the unit, get a refund and buy another at perhaps double the price.
If one can be found, that is.
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I'd like to get my hands on one of those units, to investigate.
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I'm willing to send you mine to investigate if you'd like to give me your address privately.
(Btw, why do I see "Warning: topic is currently/will be locked!
Only admins and moderators can reply." when I post here?)
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Hi Guys:
I've been sidetracked for a few weeks, so I came back to see what's up here.
I still have the same issue. I thought about taking my player back to OutletMP3, but dammit, in their eyes it's not broken! I'll end up getting the same player that one of you returned with no repairs, and I'm just not going to subject myself to that.
I just ordered a *new* 60gig replacement drive. (as described on tapersection and misticriver -- exact model known to work.) I'm going to give that a try. If it works then we know it was an HD problem. If it doesn't, then there is something different about this batch of H140s that could use some investigation.
Linus, you are more than welcome to my H140 for testing. PM me and we can make arrangements for that if possible. It's not much good to me the way it is, since I bought it primarily for recording.
If you like, I'll try replacing the new drive first -- if that works then we can guess that there is some random issue with these drives that prevents Rockbox from working.
Thanks for any help you guys.
Zeke
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Please let us know the outcome after you swap in the new HD.
I'm still having the same problem with no resolution yet.
Good luck!
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Got my *sealed* new 60gb drive yesterday. Bought the Torx today.
Hoping to install it tonight or this weekend, will let you all know if it works.
Otherwise, I'm hoping that a developer here will take it and try to make it work.
Zeke
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You're not going to need help--it's going to work.
;)
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IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
IT WILL WORK.
:P :P :P :P :P :P :P
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So: did it actually work? Have you been able to install RB and has it successfully loaded and functioned, without freezing?
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Hi Lorean:
Sorry to hear of your troubles with the forum: sounds like a ton of work.
I don't remember what my last post was on that thread -- I think I was about to try installing a new drive or did I already install it?
Well, anyway, I bought a brand new 60gb drive, installed it, formatted it, made sure it was primary, made sure it was active, reinstalled the rockbox folder and rockbox.iriver, and I got the same result=0 then hang that I had before.
So I think it stands to reason that there is something else wrong with the code than a bad harddrive. Of course, I have no idea what to do about it at this time.
I don't want to seem lazy, but I am pretty good with installing operating systems and troubleshooting computers. I've been doing it actively for 15 years. But I'm not a coder, so if it ain't written down somewhere then I can't fix it.
I'm begging someone at this forum with the connections/skill to make this work will take my H140 (now H160) will have mercy on us poor folks who have bought these H140s just to run rockbox. Without rockbox the 200 bucks plus 150 HD is worthless to me.
Please take pity on us, we wanna rock too.
Zeke
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Please search the forums first before you jump to conclusions. I have merged your recent post with the topic that had already been moved over from the old forums. Also, regardless of what may have happened to the thread, it belongs in the hardware forums, *not* the iriver installation forum.
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Hi scorche:
I did search and look thru the forum, but since it was immediately after the change to the site I don't think this post was back on the site. Or at least I didn't expect to see it in the hardware area.
I think that it's very debatable that this is a hardware issue. I think that's assuming a lot of information on your part.
Consider this:
The player works fine with the original iriver software. No problems at all. New 60gig drive: again, no problems at all with the iriver software, but I'm still experiencing the freeze after "result = 0"....
So why does everyone here persist with the belief that it *must* be a hardware problem?
If you have a computer that works fine with windoze, but won't work with linux do you assume that the computer has a hardware issue? I think not. It's obviously a problem with the linux OS/software, right? At least that's where the deductive reasoning that I use at work everyday would lead me.
Maybe they did make some sort of change in hardware that doesn't play well with rockbox, but I doubt it. I work as an mech engineer in the semiconductor/storage industry and when we get a product working properly it does not receive any changes near the end of its lifecycle. The only changes you would see are those that address a specific customer problem. Improvements are reserved for future products.
I'm begging the folks here at rockbox to help me out with this. Isn't there anyone here who cares enough about rockbox to at least let me send you my H140 to investigate the problem? If you really believe in Rockbox then why not back it up by seriously looking into this problem?
Sincerely,
Zeke
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Another owner of a H140 with the same problem was supposed to send me his unit, but he chickened out. Then I lost interest. If you want to send me yours, fine. PM me and I'll give you my address.
BTW, I live in Sweden.
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If anyone can resolve this it is LinusN. It's in hardware because so far only OutletMP3 players have reported this problem. While correlation does not imply causation, hardware differences seem the most likely cause. In your windows example, if Linux had failed because it lacked drivers, it would've qualified as hardware in this context. Not just problems with hardware but those that are caused by Rockbox not supporting it right yet.
Simply put, this forum is primarily for "Problems Rockbox has with specific hardware." In fact, BROKEN hardware belongs in the Repair subforum. That seems to be the point you've missed.
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Llorean and LinusN:
Thanks. Â You're right, I did miss the point. Â I was just thinking that since the SW needs some work to support the HW that it was a SW problem. Â No matter, I had a little trouble locating the thread after it was moved.
I'll PM you with more information. Â I really appreciate your offer to have a look at it, and of course I trust you guys with it.
My grandfather Sven Arne was an immigrant from Stockholm, so you and I are nearly brothers. Â ;D
out,
Zeke
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Another owner of a H140 with the same problem was supposed to send me his unit, but he chickened out.
Yes, but "chickened out" only in the sense that I wanted to make full use of my 90-day warrranty, which was, at that time, soon to expire.
I'd already sent my h140 back to Digital Outlet twice, and they twice had sent it to the iRiver company for HD repair.
This time they told me they would swap the unit for another. I was dubious about that, since I'd heard they had no more h140s left, but decided to go ahead with this and that maybe they really did have one or two laying around.
But of course they simply sent me back my same old unit -- it was a bluff by one of the young employees. He even tried to keep the bluff going after I called him on it, saying he had in fact sent me a new unit.
("You really thought I wouldn't copy down the serial number before I sent it to you?" I asked him.)
So I spoke to the guy who runs the place, who, right there while I was on the phone with him, bawled out the employee for lying to me.
The upshot of all this is that I still have an h140 that I absolutely cannot get to accept a RockBox install.
Linus, might I humbly ask if you'd still be interested in investigating this unit? You're my last hope before I sell the thing -- I don't want it if it won't run RB.
I still have your address, just let me know.
Thanks,
watchpocket
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I have another H140 on its way to me for investigation, so stay tuned.
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*dunno lurks here as this should be interesting*
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I have another H140 on its way to me for investigation, so stay tuned.
Great -- I will definitely stay tuned.
Do you happen to know if it's one from the OutletMP3 batch?
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Do you happen to know if it's one from the OutletMP3 batch?
Yes it is.
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OK, here are the first results from my investigation.
The unit I have has been refurbished. A power regulator has been replaced, so I think this unit has once been charged with the wrong charger.
The entire assembly is more modern than the units I've seen before, so this is definitely one of the later batches to leave the iriver factory. The CPU is a SCF5249VF140, but it is not marked in the same way as on the earlier models I've seen.
So far I've noticed that the PLL is different somehow. I have managed to start Rockbox by lowering the max CPU frequency to 90MHz, but when I do, all the other timing is way off. Therefore I think the PLL is different in some way. I'll have to investigate further...
Stay tuned.
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Thanks for the preliminary report, Linus.
I may well have a similarly refurbished unit as well -- I don't know.
I look forward to any further info as it becomes available.
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OK, here are the first results from my investigation.
[ . . . ]
Stay tuned.
Greetings, Linus. Any more info yet re: your investigation into the h140 that was sent to you?
I.e., have you had a chance to investigate further? The first report was indeed interesting and curious.
Were you ultimately able to get RB running normally and successfully on it?
Thanks,
watchpocket
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LinusN wrote:
> The entire assembly is more modern than the units I've seen before, so
> this is definitely one of the later batches to leave the iriver factory.
I'm wondering if a similarity in serial numbers between that player and
mine might tell us anything about whether my unit was also one of the same
later batch out of the factory.
If you still have that player in your possession, I wonder if you might post the
serial number or at least tell if its serial number is at all similar to mine:
The serial number of mine is: 50443060201233. Thanks --watchpocket
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Sorry for not having had time to work more on the player. The serial number is 504473060201745, not far from yours.
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Thanks, Linus.
Apologies for leaving out the "7" just after the "5044" in my serial number.
Just for the record, a friend's unit has a serial number very close in the same range, and there were no problems in the installation of Rockbox on that one, so who knows what the serial numbers ultimately tell (or don't tell) us.
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To re-cap this thread:
Serial number of my h140 unit (which refuses Rockbox): 504473060201233.
Serial number of my friend's unit (on which Rb was installed w no problem): 504473060201359.
Serial number of unit Linus under investigation by Linus (which refuses Rb): 504473060201745.
My point being that I may be (or may not be, but probably am) reading tea leaves here.
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Hey All:
Just an update. I've been busy as hell at work for the past few months and so haven't really tuned in or been in contact with Linus.
I was reminded by another "Outlet MP3 interested party" a few days ago and so I contacted Linus for an update.
So far, the problem still seems to be with the PLL/CPU. I don't know what that means, but I looked it up on e-er-net and found this:
PLL is short for phase-locked loop, an electronic circuit that controls an oscillator so that it maintains a constant phase angle (i.e., lock) on the frequency of an input, or reference, signal. A PLL ensures that a communication signal is locked on a specific frequency and can also be used to generate, modulate and demodulate a signal and divide a frequency.
I want to thank Linus for making time in his busy schedule to investigate this issue. I know that there aren't that many of us with this problem which makes it lower priority, but there aren't many H140s left (or of the H1XX series, period) and it would mean a lot to get it working. I can't wait to get some good, stealthy live recordings with it!
Thanks again to Linus and Rockbox!
Zeke
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OK guys! I think I have solved the problem. It turned out that the CPU on the player I investigated did not like to have the PLLDIV field set to 0. The data sheet says it is fine, but the CPU doesn't. By recalculating the PLL values and making sure PLLDIV != 0, I managed to run Rockbox on the OutletMP3 device.
Please try the latest SVN build and see if my fix solves the problem for the rest of you.
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Hey Linus!
Thanks a lot, sounds like you’ve found the renegade electron that’s been foiling us!
Cool, I’m super psyched about this turn of events.
Hey Y’all, test this patch ASAP so I can get my player back!
Thanks again to Linus and Rockbox – you rock.
Zeke
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Linus:
Another Update:
I have PM’ed both rickeyjt and watchpocket to test the SW fix on their H140s.
I asked them to post the information here directly so that you can get the information.
Rickey has already tried it, and confirmed that he can get his player to boot up!!! He did mention that the Recording Enhancement Package did not work – I don’t have any further details on that but hopefully he will post the issues here.
The REP is important to me for live recording, so if you could verify that it works I would be grateful.
Watchpocket said that he would try to install the daily build today while he’s at work (this is where he has a PC) and I have asked him to post his findings here as well.
I’m not sure who else is still seeking resolution to the issue – I only contacted those folks who had PM’ed me on the issue.
Thanks Everyone.
Zeke
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Did he compile the REP himself, because if not his build could simply date from before the fix was in.
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Linus wrote:
> Please try the latest SVN build and see if my fix solves the problem for the rest of you.
It's going to take me several hours tonight to fully charge my unit, and I will probably install the new build tomorrow.
In any case I'll be doing that asap and reporting here what happens.
Thanks for the heads-up, Zeke, and thanks Linus for your painstaking efforts.
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Did he compile the REP himself, because if not his build could simply date from before the fix was in.
Hi Llorean:
Hmmm, I'm afraid I don't know the answer to this. I did a little research on the REP and I see that it is a patch. (Is it still a patch, or did it make it into the regular build?) The thread is 45 pages long, so of course I did not read all of it, but it seems you either have to run Mmm's build or patch your own -- This could be the reason it didn't work?
Rickey, please give details on the problems you encountered.
Anyway, please continue to forgive my ignorance -- as much as I want to know what I'm doing I haven't run rockbox yet let alone understand how it works. When I get my H160 back I'll take more responsibility for my gross ignorance!
Thanks again all, I think I see the light at the end of the tunnel.
Zeke
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If you run my build of the REP then it won't work on your outletMP3 players as the build needs updating to the latest SVN. The patch won't work at the moment either as it is out of date since the settings update. But I will eventually get around to sorting this out... :)
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Good Morning Mmmm:
Thanks for the clarification. Another Question:
Last night I read about 20 pages of the REP thread, and from what I understand the bulk of the original recording enhancements have made their way into the regular build -- is this true?
By the way, I'm really excited get my player back so I can try out this code you've developed for us music junkies -- thank you!
out
Zeke
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YES !!!!
VICTORY !!!
At long last, Rockbox has loaded successfully on my OutletMP3-bought h140.
The Eagle has landed !!!
At first, it didn't load, but it also did not freeze with the "Result: 0" message.
(It didn't freeze at all, it just went to the iriver OS). That, it turns out, was because the ".rockbox" folder and the "rockbox.iriver" file were both themselves inside another folder.
I removed that folder so that the above-mentioned 2 items were in the root folder, and voila -- Rockbox.
This is the FIRST TIME since I bought my h140 last June (from OutletMP3, of course) that Rockbox has loaded and didn't stall out with the "Result: 0" error message.
I can't tell everyone how happy this makes me and, of course, will make Zeke and anyone else who bought their h140s from Outle tand who were or are having the same problem.
And we have Linus to thank for investigating and fixing the problem.
THANK YOU, LINUS !!!
(I gather that the fix itself was trivial once the problem was actually identified. It was identifying the problem that appears to have been not-so-trival.)
Thanks again, Linus, for your work on this and your solution-fix.
I'll post a follow-up report after I've played with my Rockbox-installed h140 a bit and familiarized myself with the Rockbox system and its workings.
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Hay All:
That's great news!! To recap, both Rickeyjt and Watchpocket can run rockbox on the troublesome OUTLET MP3 H140s. This is a fine day, and again I'd like to thanks all involved for the hard work.
Linus, thanks so much for your time we know that you are busy and I don't know how to make it up to you! If you're ever in California let me know.
In other news, Rickeyjt sent me a PM regarding my questions. He was able to run the version with the fix on his Outlet MP3 player but not the REP build -- this makes sense based on what Llorean and Mmmm stated above.
In short Rickey, you'll need to patch the daily build for the REP functionality or wait until Mmmm rebuilds with this H140 fix.
Well, that's all for now. Thanks again to all, I can't wait for the first show I hit with my H140!!
out,
Zeke
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I am now trying to determine if I have a defective h140 outletmp3 unit. When I originally got it it seemed to record ok with the iriver firmware however I never used the unit because I couldn't use rockbox and I had a backup h140 to use.
The outletmp3 unit now loads rockbox and I used it a few times to record but soon I started having problems. The playback was full of loud scratchy static. The screen looked like it froze many times. It would record for 40 minutes then drop out and pick up recording 20 minutes later. the gain control started displaying wild numbers like -876 or just way out of normal range and the agc number status would be offset by just as much.
Several times I have seen these messages on the screen:
I04: IllInstr at 3104782C
I05: DivX0 at 10000302
I04: IllInstru at 95B41400
I removed rockbox and reflashed the firmware with iriver 1.66. Recording does produce the scratchy static now too.
Don't know what to make of this and wondered how everyone else is doing. I will take it apart and swap hard drives between the two units and let you know what I find.