Iriver 120 and Clipping at Bass Boost

[MichaelG]

Hello Forum,

since the last two builds i have clippings when i use the bass equalizer. The old builds (i don't know since when) reduces the volume (Gain) when you used it.

Ok jetzt in deutsch falls einer mein Kauderwelsch nicht versteht und es eventuell in vernünftiges Englisch übersetzen kann.
In den letzten 2 Versionen wird die Lautstärke (Gain) nicht mehr reduziert wenn der Bass Equalizer (nicht der Parametriq EQ) benutzt wird. Das Clippt dann und ist nicht mehr nutzbar. Seit wann das ist weiß ich nicht. Ich lade nur sporadisch neue Versionen.
Gibts da einen Workaround?

MfG Michael

[michael.conner]

Hello Forum,

since the last two builds i have clippings when i use the bass equalizer. The old builds (i don't know since when) reduces the volume (Gain) when you used it.

Ok jetzt in deutsch falls einer mein Kauderwelsch nicht versteht und es eventuell in vernünftiges Englisch übersetzen kann.
In den letzten 2 Versionen wird die Lautstärke (Gain) nicht mehr reduziert wenn der Bass Equalizer (nicht der Parametriq EQ) benutzt wird. Das Clippt dann und ist nicht mehr nutzbar. Seit wann das ist weiß ich nicht. Ich lade nur sporadisch neue Versionen.
Gibts da einen Workaround?

MfG Michael

auf Englisch:

Ok, now in German, in case someone doesn't understand my gibberish and can eventually translate it into intelligible English.

In the last two versions, volume/gain is no longer reduced when the bass equalizer (not the parametric EQ) is used. It clips then and is no longer usable. How long that's been doing so, I don't know. I only sporadically load new versions.  Is there a workaround?

with friendly greetings,
MichaelG

[michael.conner]

Have you tried "precut" in the EQ settings?  (Hast du mal "precut" in den EQ-Einstellungen probiert?)  

[MichaelG]

Have you tried "precut" in the EQ settings?  (Hast du mal "precut" in den EQ-Einstellungen probiert?)  

Yes, that works. But then i must enable the parametric EQ. In the old versions it works without this.

(Ja, das geht. Dafür muss aber der Parametric EQ eingeschaltet sein. Bei den früheren Versionen ging das doch ohne diesen Trick.)

MfG Michael

[nls]

if (volume + bass boost)  <= 0db you should be fine, so just don't crank the volume so high :-)

[bluebrother]

since the last two builds i have clippings when i use the bass equalizer. The old builds (i don't know since when) reduces the volume (Gain) when you used it.

I'm pretty sure Rockbox never reduced some volume gain at anytime. Maybe you had the "prevent clipping" option enabled  before?

PS: lass doch den Quatsch mit "MfG", das versteht hier doch eh fast keiner (und sieht für diejenigen die kein Deutsch können einfach nur komisch aus). Mach einfach nicht so laut Btw, http://www.rockbox-lounge.de könnte für dich interessant sein.

[MichaelG]

@Bluebrother:
So jetzt nur auf Deutsch und dann gehe ich ins Deutsche Forum (Danke für den Link): Nein, die müssen was geändert haben. Ich habe die ganzen Variationen mit Equalizer, Vorverstärkung, "Prevent Clipping" u.s.w. durch. Von einem Tag auf den anderen (von vielen Firmwareversionen auf die letzten beiden) ist die Gainabsenkung plötzlich weg. Früher konntest du den Bass db-weise zuschalten und es wurde dann halt leiser. Warum ist das auf einmal weg?

So und jetzt ohne Mfg :-)

[Rough English translation:  Only in German and then I will go to German forum (thanks for the link): No, something must have changed.  I have been through all of the variations with Equalizer, preamplification, “Prevent Clipping” etc.  In one of the daily builds [??] (of many firmware versions on last the two) the gain reduction suddenly went away.  [Not sure of this sentence.  Previously, you could raise the bass and the volume became quieter?] Why did that go away?]

[xlarge]

@Bluebrother:
So jetzt nur auf Deutsch und dann gehe ich ins Deutsche Forum (Danke für den Link): Nein, die müssen was geändert haben. Ich habe die ganzen Variationen mit Equalizer, Vorverstärkung, "Prevent Clipping" u.s.w. durch. Von einem Tag auf den anderen (von vielen Firmwareversionen auf die letzten beiden) ist die Gainabsenkung plötzlich weg. Früher konntest du den Bass db-weise zuschalten und es wurde dann halt leiser. Warum ist das auf einmal weg?

So und jetzt ohne Mfg :-)

Come on!
http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=5738.0
"3. Use standard English...."

[AlexP]

OK, I don't know what the 2nd to last post said, but way back in the day when swcodec was H1x0 only, rockbox had some limiting in it to automatically prevent clipping.  I can't remember which way round it was, but I think the OF reduced bass/treble gain to prevent clipping, and rockbox reduced volume to prevent clipping if vol + bass would have exceeded maximum.  This was later (and quite early on) removed.

[bluebrother]

@Bluebrother:
So jetzt nur auf Deutsch ...

please PM me if you want to tell me something in german. There are quite a lot of people in this forum (who might be able helping your) that don't understand german.

And for "they must have changed something": I have the same player, and I'm actively involved with Rockbox. I'm currently pretty much short on time but I'm also pretty sure I would have noticed such a significant change. You might want to check the svn logs.

[Llorean]

There was a VERY brief period where if you increased Bass past the clipping point it decreased volume to compensate, but it was decided that it was inappropriate for the firmware to be performing a hidden volume decrease. This 'brief period' was well over a year ago, as it predates the iPod ports entirely, so unless you haven't updated in over at least 14 months, this would not be a new change. (The period was more than 14 months ago, I'm just not sure how much more.)

One thing that never happened though: You were never able to reach a bass/volume/treble combination that you can't reach now.

Just be aware that any time you're greater than 0dB you may/will have clipping depending on your audio file. So, if your volume is at -3 and your bass is at +5, expect some potential clipping. And be aware that listening in single digit volumes is likely to be bad for your ears in the first place.

Also, please don't place German in your posts. This is an English language forum, and most of us cannot tell if there is additional information in the German that is not in the English. Our guidelines on the issue are clear. Thank you.

[markun]

I'm pretty sure Rockbox never reduced some volume gain at anytime. Maybe you had the "prevent clipping" option enabled  before?

The feature was added on 4 december 2005:

http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=8145

and removed again 3 days later:

http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=8197

[Llorean]

As a note, are you referring to the "Bass" setting, or the "Equalizer", because the two are handled differently. The graphical equalizer has always required the manual setting of the prescale.

[Febs]

I've added a VERY rough translation of the German post.  Disclaimer:  it has been many years since I studied German in school, and I make no promises that the translation is accurate!

Llorean, it looks like the German portion of his initial post talks about the "bass equalizer" and not the "Parametric EQ," so presumably he is talking about the bass setting, not the equalizer (though the English translation he provided does not make that distinction).

Edit:

To the original poster:  jethead just committed this change.  Perhaps it relates to your problem:

Date: 2007-03-13 16:05:46 +0100 (Tue, 13 Mar 2007)
New Revision: 12752

Log Message:
H100 Series: Fix FS#6810 - Distortion on Bass/Treble usage. Coldfire PCM needed a refinement in the init sequence for the UDA1380 after audio init changes. Apparently it doesn't like its registers altered before the Coldfire I2S is properly initialized.

[MichaelG]

Excause me, that i have only posted in German, but my School-english is very horrible. But I try...

I don't mean the parametric EQ, I mean the Bass Settings.  And the Problem ist until 2-3 weeks ago.

@Febs: I don't understand the Log Message. Is this a Problem that would be fixed in future versions? Can someone translate me the quintessence of the message?