Blowing off some steam.

[Soundcrafter]

I'll ve honest here. RockBox LOOKS fricktackular amazing (I'm still on modded iPod firmware via iPodWizard). But, it's a pain in the ass to install, and even more of a pain to convert my library to be recognized by RockBox, something that is absolutely necessary (I can never spell that damned word.) for me...cuz, you know, an iPod is a MUSIC player first and foremost.

(I'm not submitting this as a feature request because there's many problems here, and most may not even be fixed or even considered.

So here's a compiled list of grievances against RockBox for video iPod:
-PITA (Pain in the ass) Library Conversion
-Hard installation of rockbox. I might write a simple batch file to compile the two or three programs required to install Rockbox.
-Battery Problems. There's no way in hell I'm running RockBox on an iPod that doesn't have much of a battery anyway. This has already been addressed, however, and I'm looking forward to it.
-AAC Problems: Sketchy Playback for BRs over 128 (All of my AACS are 192+, and I'm a semi-audiophile, so you're not talking me into downconversion.), Can't (And most likely never) play Protected AACs, and so I'm out $20+ in purchased music, and another $40 in purchased videos. Sure, I could rip the DRM out, but that takes time, and more time, and time I don't have. Yeargh.
-Adding songs to your player is no longer pretty. I LOVE iTunes. I DESPISE Windows Explorer.
-Videos? Couldn't get em to work for me. Hmm. Maybe just me though.

That's about everything. But since I'm not just a complainer, here's what we could do to encourage more people (Including myself) to RockBox their 'Pods:

-Library Manager. Obviously, people here are programmers, and this shouldn't be too hard of a task, seeing as you're only dealing with MP3s and copying them to a disk. I'm learning C++, so if I can help, I will.
-Ditch that ugly-as-**** default theme, and make it look more like the native firmware.
-Installation could easily be greatly improved, and I'd love it if someone already had a compiled ItunesDBtoTagCache prog.
-And obviously, fixing the other problems would help, a ton. The iPod is the most widespread media player, and if more people used RockBox, more would know about it, and in turn, more would use it.

So that's what I've got. This could very well piss some people off, just because I'm bitching about RB before I've even (permanently) converted to it, but I'm ready for any opinions or such.

[Llorean]

- Library conversion? Honestly, WTF are you talking about? Rockbox plays more formats than the iPod does, so you don't have to convert anything. TagCache can automatically find and index the hidden files, and since you can just drag and drop files on your player or use ANY music management software available (since TagCache can find files hidden by even the most esoteric organizational structure) where is this pain for conversion? Wouldn't it be Rockbox that adapts to your library by the conveniences of automatic indexing, rather than the other way around?

- Rockbox isn't out yet. I'll thank you to not talk about inconvenient installation precedures when there is no final installer yet. If you look at the Archoses (the only one with a release) there is a convenient executable installer. Right now, you're testers. If you can't handle a relatively simple command line install process, I honestly begin to doubt whether you have any real interest in contributing to the project.

- Well yes, there are battery problems. IT'S STILL IN DEVELOPMENT. We admit to these problems. Frequently. We've explained where they come from (wholly undocumented hardware that is very likely losing power to some hardware not properly disabled or suspended, and we haven't found out where yet).

- AAC problems: See work on dual core support. Once this actually works, all bitrates should run fine. As for yoru AAC music, $60 worth of songs should be able to be batch converted overnight. If you can't afford your computer time while you're sleeping, well, that's fine. But I don't see what you expect us to do about the fact that you got conned into paying for nearly-useless music.

- You can use iTunes. You can use Explorer. You can use Mediamonkey. You can use ANY PROGRAM YOU LIKE.

- Videos work fine for me. No audio yet (again waiting on dual core support to be finalized) but again, there's no streamlined conversion process because the current intermediary format is *not* what the final format will be (since it contains no audio.)

On to your second half:

- See MediaMonkey, or any other UMS-device library manager. Or see iTunes. You can use it, though considering your statements, this "you" may be exclusive of the individual you to whom I speak. We even have instructions in the FAQ for how to make use of iTunes synced music.

- No. We may choose a better looking theme, but why on Earth should we try to look like the Apple firmware as a default? Most of us don't like it, and you're entirely free to change themes as you'd like. Rockbox didn't start on iPods. It won't end on iPods. It should look like Rockbox on all targets. If you want the original firmware's appearance, feel free, but it won't be the default.

- Installation will be greatly improved. Once there's a released version to install.

- Can you fix the other problems? If you cannot fix them, SHUT UP. Seriously. You have no right to complain about how long it takes unless you're going to step in and do something. These are volunteers. They're working on it. If it's not fast enough for you, you can step in and take over. Until you're willing to do that, accept that they are working, FOR FREE, to do this. They are not selling the software. They do not OWE you the software. You have no right to make demands of them. NONE.


I suggest you spend a little time actually learning about what the software can and cannot do (since your post shows a clear ignorance from this, since you seem to feel iTunes can't be used), and then learn a little about the actual state of the software (try thinking of it as an "alpha" if phrases like in-development are not specific enough for you).

[Febs]

-PITA (Pain in the ass) Library Conversion

I know that Llorean has already said this, but it bears repeating:  WTF are you talking about?!

-Hard installation of rockbox. I might write a simple batch file to compile the two or three programs required to install Rockbox.

I didn't find it in the least bit difficult.  I simply followed the step-by-step directions and it worked.  However, if you want to write a batch file, then we would certainly welcome that contribution.

-Adding songs to your player is no longer pretty. I LOVE iTunes. I DESPISE Windows Explorer.

So use iTunes.  I really don't understand what your issue is here.

-Library Manager. Obviously, people here are programmers, and this shouldn't be too hard of a task, seeing as you're only dealing with MP3s and copying them to a disk. I'm learning C++, so if I can help, I will.

What would a library manager do that itsn't already accomplished by dozens of other available programs?

-Ditch that ugly-as-**** default theme, and make it look more like the native firmware.

Like WHICH native firmware?  Rockbox runs on many different platforms.  Regardless, Rockbox is NOT the native firmware, so why should it look like the native firmware?

-Installation could easily be greatly improved, and I'd love it if someone already had a compiled ItunesDBtoTagCache prog.

What would a ItunesDBtoTagCache prog do that Tag Cache cannot do already?

-And obviously, fixing the other problems would help, a ton.

Well, we await your patches.  Saying, "problems should be fixed" is really useless.  Fixing the problems is helpful.

[dcr693]

WTF is the problem with people? Taking a free piece of software, not even really understanding what it is actually capable of and complaining about it? I mean, come on dude. I know the Internet has spawned a generation of people who are used to getting exactly what they want for free, but please, don't spoil it for the rest of us.

Soundcrafter, I don't usually reply to posts like these because it feels like a waste of time. I hope you won't take this response the wrong way. Take some time to educate yourself about Rockbox is and what it is not.

If you take away only one thing from the replies to this thread, let it be this: if you are so happy with iTunes and your current setup, why the heck are you looking to change it? (I especially love the part where you say the iPod is a music player "first and foremost" then go onto complain about the lack of mature video support on Rockbox.)

If you want to speak intelligently about Rockbox, then please post back with your questions and we'll all be glad to answer your questions and share your opinions. But don't make us feel like we're wasting our time defending a free project that neither asks for your approval nor needs it. If you really don't like it, you can have a full refund of your purchase price.

[mnhnhyouh]

-Ditch that ugly-as-**** default theme, and make it look more like the native firmware.

Is it not possible to have a compiler directive that assigns a different default theme for each platform? This would allow a more sophisticated default theme for those platforms that are able to support it, and not require the default theme to be tied to the lowest common denominator.

If this were possible I would ask it *not* to look like the original firmware, but distinctly different.

h

[Yotto]

Actually, just a different default font would work.  On the iPod video, for instance, anything less than 12-point is difficult to read.

[JdGordon]

im sure if someone sent a patch to flyspray about a different default font for some targets it would be looked at

[Davide-NYC]

I say we link directly to this thread from the goldenquotes wiki page.


^^ that's supposed to be humor ^^

[Llorean]

The default font is compiled in. While it's certainly doable, it needs to be *very* carefully chosen since it's the font that will be used when no others are available.

That being said, I really have no objection to different default themes as long as there's a semi-consistent look. For example, look at the way iCatcher looks across all targets. While it doesn't get my vote as a default, it does maintain a fairly consistent visual style across targets.

[L]

Wow, just wow. Halfway reading through his post, I got pissed off. After reading Llorean's, I just feel sorry for that guy.

[Adam]

itdb2tc (or, as you called it, ItunesDBtoTagCache) now has been compiled for windows.  Give it a shot.

[Llorean]

While I don't mind people being critical about Rockbox, I do demand that they actual demonstrate a knowledge of what they're being critical about.

Rockbox has its flaws, as everything does, but to complain about what is essentially the fact that it is not complete for iPods yet when we've made no secret of this, and in fact cover many of its flaws on the IpodFAQ page is just being silly.

[wafflesomd]

You expect your DAP to perform up to audiophile standards?

Your in the wrong place buddy.

[Febs]

Where does he say that?  He simply said that he doesn't want to transcode lossy files.  

[Soundcrafter]

Actually, Febs, I said I'm a semi-audiophile, but waffle, that doesn't mean I'm not entitled to use a DAP (hence the part where i said 192+. Most of my files are actually even higher than that (depending on how much I like the songs  )


WOW. It's obvious I made a total jackass out of myself, and made the worst first impression I've ever made in my life. My apologies, I wrote the initial post when I was tired, and a little pissed at RockBox (for reasons already listed, mostly because of the itdb2tc dealie [Which had NOT been compiled for Windows at the time]) So again, please accept my apologies for me making me look like the most n00bish asshole fucktard you've ever met.


I DEFINATELY blew past a TON of stuff here, and I really, TRULY apologize if I pissed any of you off (which is evident.) Thanks for clarifying everything, and once again, sorry.