iPod 6 Classic with Rockbos is not recognized by Windows 10 after adding files

[QRDeNameland]

Yeah, I can't even get it back to the point where AOMEI sees it so that I can reformat it again.  It does show up in Device Manager when in DFU mode, though.

[Frankenpod]

I wonder if the main issue is that it's a 6th gen, so can't cope with more than 128g in original firmware mode.  Usually I'd say the solution to your database issue would be to boot it in original firmware or disk mode, and then connect it to the computer and delete the files causing the problem.  But with a 6th gen if it has >128gb, and you boot it in the original firmware mode, weird things can happen, as the original firmware of a 6th gen can't cope with larger drives.  So there may be no way to fix it.

I was wondering whether rockbox's ability to support flash mods had improved to the point where it could be used exclusively without needing the original firmware.  Because that would make ipods older than 7.5gen usable for such mods.  But from what you are reporting it sounds as if that isn't the case...unless there's some other problem going on.

[QRDeNameland]

I wonder if the main issue is that it's a 6th gen, so can't cope with more than 128g in original firmware mode.  Usually I'd say the solution to your database issue would be to boot it in original firmware or disk mode, and then connect it to the computer and delete the files causing the problem.  But with a 6th gen if it has >128gb, and you boot it in the original firmware mode, weird things can happen, as the original firmware of a 6th gen can't cope with larger drives.  So there may be no way to fix it.

I was wondering whether rockbox's ability to support flash mods had improved to the point where it could be used exclusively without needing the original firmware.  Because that would make ipods older than 7.5gen usable for such mods.  But from what you are reporting it sounds as if that isn't the case...unless there's some other problem going on.

But it was working before, with well over 500GB of files on it, even with v 3.15.  Why is not working now after simply copying new files to it?  Also, what is 'disk mode'....is that the same as DFU mode?  It is very difficult to collate all of the terminology when scouring through 20 years of forums posts.

[Frankenpod]

When you say it was working before - did you ever boot it into the original firmware?  I gather that if you do that with a 6th gen that has more than 128gb it won't react well.  Not sure what exactly it would do, maybe just lose everything over 128gb or more likely just declare that it needs to be restored?

And the problem, as I understand it, is that RB isn't flawless at writing to the drive with flash mods - something to do with the timings or with power saving modes or something?

So it might work fine for a while until you write files to it or try to build the database and it gets corrupted.   I guess you just were lucky with the initial sync of content to it, but then your luck turned. 

My understanding is that that has gotten much better with more recent versions of RB, but I haven't really experimented with it much myself - don't want to risk messing the file system up.  Was actually curious to know if it had been entirely fixed now, but sounds as if not.

Usually the the way out is to use the original firmware to fix or delete any corrupted files, but I don't think that's possible for a 6th gen because of that 128gb limit.

  Disk mode is just the feature of the original non-rockboxed ipod that lets it connect to the computer as just a USB storage device (hold down centre button and play button)

[QRDeNameland]

When you say it was working before - did you ever boot it into the original firmware?  I gather that if you do that with a 6th gen that has more than 128gb it won't react well.  Not sure what exactly it would do, maybe just lose everything over 128gb or more likely just declare that it needs to be restored?

No, I think you are correct here.  If I plug it into a computer with iTunes installed, it recognizes that there is iPod attached but then just gives an error.  I have never been able to get it to boot to the original firmware.  In fact, with the last rebuild, I could only mount it as a drive on a computer *without* iTunes installed.

Still, it doesn't seem as if it's copying the files that is the issue, it was fine, and even seemed to OK with *building* the database, it just dies after trying to reboot.

If I can ever manage to get it to be recognized as a drive again, even just to be able to reformat from scratch, it seems the best option is to just not use the database. 

[Frankenpod]

Yeah, I guess that's the only solution.  I just had a go and successfully built the database (along with getting the pictureflow plug-in working) on a 7.5gen (with 86,000 tracks wasn't sure it would manage it).  So don't know why it won't work for you.

  I was actually wondering if 6th gens were now usable for large flash mods.

That would be the case if RB had improved support to the point where booting into the original firmware wasn't necessary at all (i.e. no disk problems cropping up with Rockbox that needed the original firmware to fix/avoid).  As second-hand 6th gens are far more common and cheaper than 7.5 gens (the slim 160gb models, and _only_ those models) it would be nice if that were the case, but I guess your experience is a data-point towards concluding otherwise.

I'm pretty sure, by the way, that it's writing to the disk that causes the problem.  Sounds as if your database build fell over in the second phase, when it writes various intermediate files to the drive.  One of those writes getting corrupted will cause it to hang on the reboot as you describe.  One solution might be if the devs do what was implied above in the thread and update all the pre-built windows simulators for up-to-date versions of RB.  Then you could do the thing of building the database on the computer and copying the files across.  I'd rather do that myself as it seems to impose a lot of work on the ipod to make it build the database on the device, even when it works.

[QRDeNameland]

Well, at this point, I can't get access to the drive for love or money, so unless someone has some advice for that, I'm pretty much screwed here.

[philden]

One thing you could try is to replace your current storage with one 128GB (or smaller) microSD card and see if you can then use the iPod in both the Apple firmware and Rockbox. That would show you that the system works.

[QRDeNameland]

One thing you could try is to replace your current storage with one 128GB (or smaller) microSD card and see if you can then use the iPod in both the Apple firmware and Rockbox. That would show you that the system works.

That requires reopening the iPod, which this model is damn near impossible.  I had someone else do the original work in the first place for precisely that reason.  Unfortunately, I have been unable to contact them.  Obviously, this was all a huge mistake knowing now what a huge clusterf*ck this all is.

[Frankenpod]

It's difficult, and is somewhat likely to damage the ipod housing (and if you are careless, the ipod's internals), but it's not impossible.

[QRDeNameland]

It's difficult, and is somewhat likely to damage the ipod housing (and if you are careless, the ipod's internals), but it's not impossible.

I've seen the tutorials on youtube.  Considering how horribly the software end of this has gone, I'd more than likely end up losing a finger or two.  Not to mention, when so far the situation has just gone from bad to worse, what is my likelihood of success? 

What I don't understand is:  if Rockbox can boot enough to get to Committing Database part, why can't the drive be seen at all?

[Frankenpod]

It's difficult, and is somewhat likely to damage the ipod housing (and if you are careless, the ipod's internals), but it's not impossible.

I've seen the tutorials on youtube.  Considering how horribly the software end of this has gone, I'd more than likely end up losing a finger or two.  Not to mention, when so far the situation has just gone from bad to worse, what is my likelihood of success? 

What I don't understand is:  if Rockbox can boot enough to get to Committing Database part, why can't the drive be seen at all?

The last point, I don't know, you'd have to ask a developer, I'm just a RB user (and frequent mangler of ipods).  Though I'd guess when the ipod is engaged in that database process it hasn't got to the point of executing the code that can communicate with the computer.

  I was going to mention I've opened and re-opened dozens of the things, and only cut myself to the point of getting blood on the motherboard once.  I think you might have more luck if the ipod was only using 128gb, though, as philden suggests.  Then you could use the original firmware if RB ever got into a catatonic state again.  Even just openning it and disconnecting/reconnecting the battery might reboot it to the point where you could restore it.  But the classic screw-up when opening the things is to break the battery connector off the motherboard completely.

I've gotten a few 6th gens to work with 128gb cards, even using generic non-iFlash adaptors.  But generally I would only use 7.5gens (or ipod Video) for larger capacities.

So the computer doesn't even see it if you connect it, and then force it into DFU mode (holding down centre+menu for a long period)?

[Bilgus]

I'm not in to ipods but once you get this sorted I think I have a patch that might help the next  person
https://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/c/rockbox/+/5345 [Feature] add a prompt to database commit on start-up

[QRDeNameland]

So the computer doesn't even see it if you connect it, and then force it into DFU mode (holding down centre+menu for a long period)?

Yep, tried on 3 different computers, two with iTunes installed and one without.  In DFU mode, it does show up in Device Manager on 3 machines, but does not show up as a drive either in Explorer, in Safely Remove Hardware, or in Disk Management or AOMEI.  In regular boot mode, it doesn't even show up in Device Manager.  I was able to reformat in DFU mode while 3.15 was still installed, but now with the development build on there I got nothing to work with.

[Frankenpod]

So the computer doesn't even see it if you connect it, and then force it into DFU mode (holding down centre+menu for a long period)?

Yep, tried on 3 different computers, two with iTunes installed and one without.  In DFU mode, it does show up in Device Manager on 3 machines, but does not show up as a drive either in Explorer, in Safely Remove Hardware, or in Disk Management or AOMEI.  In regular boot mode, it doesn't even show up in Device Manager.  I was able to reformat in DFU mode while 3.15 was still installed, but now with the development build on there I got nothing to work with.

If it were me, at that point I'd open it up again, and either reformat the cards in a card-reader before trying again, or just give up and put that iflash and cards in a 7.5gen and try with a 128gb card in that 6th gen.

[EDIT] actually, thinking about it, I'm not entirely sure it is supposed to show up as a drive (as opposed to just a 'device') when it's in DFU mode.  Can't actually remember (and can't check because I'm in the middle of syncing an ipod).  The idea is to restore it with iTunes at that point, as iTunes should say it's found an ipod in recovery mode.