16/44 APE Files Won't play properly on Clip Zip

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Legolad:
Hi folks,

I've recently ripped a bunch of discs to APE using Monkey's Audio.

When I boot into the Sansa firmware, the player doesn't show these new APE files at all. The Sansa firmware does still list the MP3s and some older FLACs I ripped previously. The Sansa firmware can also play all of the these older MP3s and FLACs.

When I boot into Rockbox, the database finds and lists everything (the old MP3s and FLACs, as well as the new APE files. Rockbox plays the old MP3s and FLACs without issue. However, when I try to play the newly ripped APE files, Rockbox intermittently freezes up during playback - like a bad stutter.

The only weird thing I can find in the newer APE files is the note about the cover art being "too large to display".
Could that be the cause of this problem?

Here is a link to one of the newly ripped APE files:
SAMPLE FILE: David Bowie - 01 - Watch That Man.ape https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B42ljdSnhDApZ2stUkR4VkZhU2s/edit?usp=sharing

And here is the File Info from Monkey's Audio:
FILE INFO FROM MONKEY'S AUDIO
Monkey's Audio 3.99 (Insane)
Format: 44.1 khz, 16 bit, 2 ch
Length: 4:29 (11885244 blocks)
Tag: APE Tag v2.00 (10402 bytes)
Title: Watch That Man
Album: Aladdin Sane
Album Artist: David Bowie
Genre: Pop/Rock
Year: 1973 04 13
Composer: David Bowie
Disc: 1/1
Label: EMI Music Distribution
UPC: 4988006775107
Style: Hard Rock; Glam Rock; Contemporary Pop/Rock; Proto-Punk; Experimental Rock; Album Rock; Art Rock
Cover Art (front): <too large to display>
Artist: David Bowie
Track: 01/10
Rating: 5
Source: CD (Lossless)
Tool Name: dBpoweramp Release 14.4
Encoder: Monkeys Audio v4.06 PP
Encoder Settings: -c="5000"
AccurateRipResult: AccurateRip: Accurate (confidence 33) [105A10CD]
AccurateRipDiscID: 010-0010600a-0081571d-7a09bd0a-1

saratoga:
That's normal. Insane compression on ape requires something like a desktop PC or high end cell phone processor to decode in real time. Take a look at these benchmarks for ape on your CPU: http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/CodecPerformanceComparison#AMS_AS3525v2_w_47_40MHz_PClK_40ARM926EJ_45S_41

Legolad:
Thanks, Saratoga!

If you don't mind, I have a few questions about these playback test results.
I see that my Clip Zip has the same processor as the Clip+ and Fuze v2, so that's why you linked to this test result:

--- Code: ---r27289 on 05 July 2010 by Jennifer.
[b]Sansa FuzeV2 Monkeys Audio[/b]
ape_c1000.ape 579.38% realtime Decode time - 30.36s 41.42MHz
ape_c2000.ape 410.78% realtime Decode time - 42.82s 58.42MHz
ape_c3000.ape 273.94% realtime Decode time - 64.21s 87.61MHz
ape_c4000.ape 107.34% realtime Decode time - 163.86s 223.58MHz
ape_c5000.ape 25.62% realtime Decode time - 686.43s 936.76MHz
--- End code ---

Looking at these APE results, I think this means that my processor is capable of playing the first sample (c1000.ape) at 579% of real time with a decode time of 30.36 seconds. The last item - 41.42MHz - looks like it's the processing speed used to do the decode.

If I'm right about that, it makes sense to me that the last file (c5000.ape) was created using Insane Compression. The 25% of realtime would account for the halting playback. But what should I make of the 936.76MHz? Is that a theoretical number? Or is that the maximum MHz for my processor and it still isn't enough to decode in 100% realtime?

So this begs the question: What is the actual value behind each of the Monkey's Audio compression settings?
To find out, I converted my sample song to each of the five settings.

The file size ranges from 31.2 MB (Insane) to 32.0 MB (Fast) - not enough to worry about in my case.

Listening to the files reveals no substantive difference in the first three compression levels (Fast, Normal, and High). The playback sounds the same and the fast forward and reverse seem to work fine in all three levels.
The Extra High file sounds the same as well, but it does have occasional freezing (every 10-20 seconds or so) similar to the Insane file. The Insane file freezes every other second so I can't really assess the sound quality.

I think this means I need to re-encode all my APE files using one of the first 3 compression settings.

What do you think? Am I missing anything here?

Thanks,
Legolad

saratoga:

--- Quote from: Legolad on March 25, 2014, 12:05:38 PM ---If I'm right about that, it makes sense to me that the last file (c5000.ape) was created using Insane Compression. The 25% of realtime would account for the halting playback. But what should I make of the 936.76MHz? Is that a theoretical number? Or is that the maximum MHz for my processor and it still isn't enough to decode in 100% realtime?
--- End quote ---

Its saying you'd need to run your processor at ~ 1GHz to decode that file without stuttering. Since it only runs at clocks less than 250 MHz, you are out of luck.

--- Quote from: Legolad on March 25, 2014, 12:05:38 PM ---Listening to the files reveals no substantive difference in the first three compression levels (Fast, Normal, and High).

--- End quote ---

Wait what? You realize APE is a lossless format right?

--- Quote from: Legolad on March 25, 2014, 12:05:38 PM ---What do you think? Am I missing anything here?

--- End quote ---

Yes, using APE is dumb on a portable. Its going to kill your battery life for no reason. Just use flac, its about the same size as APE on lower settings, but many times more power efficient.

Legolad:
Thanks again.

--- Quote ---Wait what? You realize APE is a lossless format right?
--- End quote ---

By your reaction I'm guessing I don't really understand what all of this means. For the record, I am new to lossless encoding and don't fully understand it. So please forgive my ignorance.

I had assumed that having different "levels" of APE compression meant that the encoding would take longer. I also assumed that there would be some substantive difference in the resulting files (e.g. better sound, smaller file size, etc). I did not anticipate that there would be such a huge hit to performance in the realtime decoding of the file.

From your comments, should I infer that FLAC and APE will sound the same, no matter what level of compression I use?

EDIT: I just found this table which I think clears up some of my confusion: http://wiki.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?title=Lossless_comparison
After reviewing this table, I want to say that lossless compression is focused strictly on file size and the speed of decode/encode. Do you think that's a fair statement?

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