Rockbox SD-Card incompatible on Clip Zip

[The Ceej]

That's not what my research suggests. 

Well if you know better than us, maybe you can use the results of your research to fix the bug yourself!

There's no need to be rude.  It's this kind of attitude that is the reason no one has yet been able to solve this problem.

[saratoga]

There's no need to be rude.

Not being rude, just joking.

It's this kind of attitude that is the reason no one has yet been able to solve this problem.

No, no one has been able to solve this problem because no one has tried.  See the posts in this thread. 

[The Ceej]

I intend to try.  I'll move hell and high water to keep Rockbox.  I'd do anything. Anything except buy a new microSD card because I just bought this one to replace the one that failed on me a few weeks ago, and I can't afford another yet, so this one will have to work.  The other one I have is only 8GB.

So, that said, I'd like to try this patch if anyone has a working link.  The card works with the OF and the computer.  The problem is not the card.  Rockbox works with other cards.  Ergo, the problem must be Rockbox's support for the card.

So, that narrows things down a lot.  But, unfortunately, not enough.  We don't yet know why Rockbox and class 10 cards have issues when everything we know suggests they shouldn't.  If we knew that, there would already be a solution.  Do you know where I can get this guy's patch so I can try that?

[saratoga]

We don't yet know why Rockbox and class 10 cards have issues when everything we know suggests they shouldn't.  If we knew that, there would already be a solution. 

I think the point you originally missed is that the class rating is basically meaningless.  So its not a class 10 card problem, its just a problem with some subset of modern cards (which are usually sold as class 10 since bigger is better on packaging). 

Do you know where I can get this guy's patch so I can try that?

Its been an hour.  A couple people at most have seen your post.  Check back in a day or two and see if anyone has posted it or maybe ask in IRC if you can't wait. 

[The Ceej]

its just a problem with some subset of modern cards (which are usually sold as class 10 since bigger is better on packaging).

Do we know what this problem is?  Do we have any leads on a solution (possibly with the next release)?  If so, I may just use the 8GB card (switching over the the OF if I want to play a playlist that isn't supported in the 8GB I put on that card) to tie me over.  It'll certainly be less stressful than this.

[The Ceej]

Well, I called the store where I bought the card this morning.  Fortunately, even though there's nothing wrong with the card, they're going to let me exchange it for another brand of exactly the same size.  With any luck, RockBox should work with the card I exchange it for.

I'm so grateful for their generosity.  Trying to get RockBox to work with this card (and trying to get the OF to work at all) was getting extremely stressful.

[cacat]

Hello dear Rockbox developers,

First, let me congratulate you on the hard work put to Rockbox. It really rocks!

But...latest Rockbox on Fuze v2, tried 2 different brands 16gb cards, both validated by h2testw, both class 10, both formatted with sdcard.org tool, both FREEZING! Using OF they do work.

After reading all posts here and elsewhere, seems that the majority class 10 sdhc cards DO NOT WORK with Rockbox (SanDisk ones seem to work).

So yes, there IS a problem, really.

Unfortunately I quit programming some time ago else I would help out a bit..


All the best,
cacat

[Julian67]

....the majority class 10 sdhc cards DO NOT WORK with Rockbox (SanDisk ones seem to work)..

I have a Lexar Class 10 32GB microSDHC which has been working fine in my Clip+ since I bought the card in November 2011.  I did previously have trouble with a class 10 card however it was a fake, being in fact a 16GB class 2 labelled and sold as a 32GB Class 10, and with a bogus partition table designed to fool Windows Explorer (and any tool relying on Explorer).  After writing a proper partition table it functioned like the very crappy class 2 card it really is (I got my money back).

My point is that class 10 microSDHC cards were until relatively recently both very expensive and in short supply, which led to them being very widely counterfeited.   Sansa Clips are not being counterfeited, Rockbox is not being counterfeited(!), but microSDHC cards were counterfeited in the millions with some being quality control rejects and others having bogus partition tables.  When a card behaves oddly it's probably the card.

I have various microSD and microSDHC cards from 2GB up to 32GB but several not matching printed capacity or class.  They all work if they have a valid partition table and file system.

If it was possible to rule out all cards bought from auction sites or amazon marketplace vendors I wonder if there would be any problem cards left.

[cacat]

They all work if they have a valid partition table and file system.

Well, how can we make sure of this, else than formatiing using sdcard.org software?

Today tried 3rd card, KINGSTON. The first ones were ADATA and TEAM. All of them are reported as legit by the testing software, their real speed is quite good (KINGSTON -> ADATA -> TEAM). I can assure you these are NOT fake. I own dozens of cards and work within IT field for the last 20 years or so, please trust my word.

Original firmware works fine with ALL of them.

PS: They were not bought through eBay, Amazon, etc. but from retail shops.

[urbanhusky]

I'm using a Class 10 32GB Transcend one myself and it works like a charm.
My choice to go for a Class 10 was to not wait ages for 32GB to transfer to the device (I'm using a card reader for faster speeds).

Edit: sorry for not being able to help but I wanted to provide information that not all Class 10 32GB cards are problematic.

[Julian67]

I can assure you these are NOT fake. ... please trust my word.

I trust your word and honour your expertise and experience but also think it's not useful to discuss or assess microSD cards in those terms.

I just dug out my fake 32 GB Class 10 Sandisk.   It's at least a year old, maybe two.   It arrived with a fake partition table intended to fool Explorer (and tools that depend on Explorer). The genuine looking printing on the card (Sandisk logo, Class 10, 32GB and so on) started to disintegrate so I just now rubbed it off completely to reveal the real factory printing which confirms it was manufactured as an unbranded Class 2 16GB.  It arrived with a tiny sticker on the underside, a kind of fake gold QA mark.  Peeling this off revealed a serial number stamped/etched onto the card during manufacturing.  That suggests it came from Samsung in Korea but could be bogus.

When a genuine partition table is written and the card is formatted to its true capacity it works normally on various PCs as a class 2 16GB card.  It also worked normally on an Android tablet, an old Nokia Maemo tablet and an old Nokia feature phone.  It worked OK in a full size SD adapter in my FujiFilm camera.  But if I slot it into my Clip+ neither Sansa firmware nor Rockbox will boot.  It freezes the player, there can be screen corruption and I have to hold down the power button to do a hard reset.

I know the card is a fake because it arrived with fake packaging, fake specs and fake partition table.  Possibly it's a card which from a respectable manufacturer but from a batch rejected by quality control.  Who knows?

If it had been branded, packaged and retailed as a Class 2 16GB card I could very easily believe that the card is genuine and works normally but the player has a problem.

The SDFormatter tool can write a valid partition table and file system.  h2testw can test the speed and capacity.  Neither can tell you who made the card or where, who branded it,  if the card passed QA, or if it passed through the normal supply chain. Only the manufacturer or authorised distributor can say so.

I've bought fake products from bricks and mortar stores. To my knowledge I've twice got branded fake products (a pen drive and a cell phone battery) from authorised retailers of the brands.

Companies like Sandisk and Toshiba and Samsung are known to respond if you make an enquiry offering card description and identifying numbers.

None of the above means that any problem can't or doesn't arise in Rockbox.  It does suggest that there is some way to go before you truly know that the cards are as good as you believe, and much further to go before being able to talk about "the majority class 10 sdhc cards".

[cacat]

there is some way to go before you truly know that the cards are as good as you believe

Please don't transform this discussion into a fake/genuine debate, as it's not the case. One last thing, these cards perform excellent for some months/years, using them with computers, players, phones, forensic software, etc. These are not fake. Period. Not this is the problem.

The r e a l problem is that Rockbox it is n o t compatible with each and any SDHC, SDXC card. From my tests and reads across the internet, the majority of people are complaining of this. Let me repeat for the last time: not all of us are so stupid to not remark a fake card, not everyone is buying Chinese fake bullshit from eBay, etc. Please do not insult us anymore. Thank you.

Now, anyone developing Rockbox, would be so kind do something about this or you don't care anymore? Good to know, because I'll throw away the crappy player the next second. I cannot use it with 2 or 4  GB cards, this is hilarious.

Best,
cacat

[torne]

We can't do anything about it unless we know what the problem is. None of the developers have a card that doesn't work, so we have to rely on tests/experiments done by someone who does. If you have a card that doesn't work that you know is good and works in other devices, perhaps you could send it to a developer who knows about the device in question so they can try it.

We're not magic, we can't fix problems that we don't know anything about. Please don't suggest that the reason a problem isn't resolved is because nobody cares, that's just rude.

[Galaxxian]

Recently bought a couple Clip-zips to run Rockbox on and came across this post while browsing, so figured I'd sign up and try help.

Anyhow, my player (v3.13) was already using a Kingston "class 10" 16GB and I pulled the 16GB uSD out of my DS's Flash cart to try last night, which is a Team branded "class 10". Both cards were formatted with the Panasonic SD Formatter software before use and unfortunately I can't reproduce the bug at this end, both seem to work fine.

Guess it was worth a try though.

[speedyk]

More data: I found this thread because I bought a 64 GB Micro SD card via Amazon, received it in a sealed SanDisk mailer (I can scan it for you), and it won't mount in my Clip Zip. Mounts fine in OSX, copied a lot of music to it, made disc image backups of it that are over 50 GB, is not seen when inserted in the CZ. I remove it and insert the previous 32 GB Class 10 or the other 32 non-Class 10 and they both show up in the CZ.

I just used the Rockbox installer to update to the latest dev build, dated 8/17, in case the solution had been found. Still won't read.

I have never previously needed to format a card first, sort of have a superstition about doing so with Apple's Disk Utility, but I'm going to do it with the 64 and report back if there is a change.

I registered here to post because I love RB. If I didn't I'd just move on. I wish there was such a simple and plays-anything-I-throw-at-it app for my Mac.

EDIT: Well, that was fast...the issue is exFAT, which is the formatting the card came with from SanDisk. It wouldn't work in my camera either, camera wouldn't even try to reformat it. Formatted it FAT32 and it shows up on the CZ and music plays. Now all I have to do is copy the 50 GB of music again. Posting to save someone else the hassle.