MP180

[Platin465]

First, I think this whole project is awesome.  I love how you're making people's investments an even better product than what the original developer did.

What I'd like to know is how do I go about finding out if there's any way to get another mp3 player into your busy schedule.  Where do I ask, and what info can I give you to see if it's possible at all.  Here's the information:

These are three versions of it:
Argosy MP-180
http://www.argosy.com.tw/product-detial.php?prod_id=40
ATMT Storm
http://www.atmtgroup.co.uk/html/mp3-player.htm
INOi MP-180
http://www.inoi.com/English/MP180.asp

This is a 20Gb player using a Hitachi Traveldrive.  It is very easy to take appart. 

My old Lyra player had the firmware/programs on the actual memory, so I saw that as an easy way to adapt the firmware/programs.  This player came empty except for one empty folder where you are to put your music.  I'm not sure if there is some hidden partition with files in it, or if the firmware is on a chip.

Please let me know how to go about contacting the right person on this project to see if it is plausible to adapt this player's firmware and if the Rockbox team is interested in taking it on, as well as what the team needs in order to do so.

[ego]

the easiest first step is to take it apart, scan it, start finding info about the components

unless one of the current devs is interested in this player, you're gonna have to do legwork in getting the hardware to work. this is not impossible

[Platin465]

I just saw two other people asking for similar requests on other players.  Replies to those posts led me here:
http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/NonArchos#New_Platforms

which says
"General Porting

Many people express their wishes to see Rockbox on other portable players. This page collects some links to player info and interesting projects that may or may not lead to Rockbox being ported. Feel free to start working on them! "

so, do I need to make a page for mine similar to these?:
http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GigabeatInfo
http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/XclefInfo

If so, how do I start those pages?

Thanks in advance for your help!

[Platin465]

Thank you, I'll do the scanning (you do mean for pictures, right?) and see what I can do about determining the components.

the easiest first step is to take it apart, scan it, start finding info about the components

unless one of the current devs is interested in this player, you're gonna have to do legwork in getting the hardware to work. this is not impossible

[ego]

yup, scans will be pictures. i did some digging for a more complete answer to what you have to do, and the next steps after scanning and IDing the components are

1) Use a multimeter to trace the connections on the PCB to find out how the chips are interconnected

2) Disassemble the firmware to find out how to communicate with the chips

if i remember right someone may be willing to help you out with getting the disassembler hardware, but it's gonna take pretty extensive knowledge. once the hardware is known, Rockbox is programmed in C.

i'm not trying to discourage you, but make sure you know this is going to take a lot of work to port, and a whole lot of it will fall to you.

good luck!

[mathieu]

I just got  this same player.  A great deal with a nice, 20 gig hard drive.  Anyway, I just wanted to show my interest and support in seeing new firmware.

[kiddk1]

I also have this player, LMK what I can do to help, I am very interested.

[cpnfantstk]

Add me to the list for support of a new firmware for this player.

[Bagder]

So then, create a wiki page, include close-up scans of PCBs. Identify used circuits. Figure out the upgrade procedure and involved file formats. Consider initial reverse engineering  etc.

Voicing "support" really doesn't help much.

[mathieu]

Voicing "support" really doesn't help much.

Sure it does, or at least can.  I don't have the time or skills to do any of this disecting and analyzing, but I'm egging on those who want to try.  Don't be such a cynic.

[Platin465]

yup, scans will be pictures. i did some digging for a more complete answer to what you have to do, and the next steps after scanning and IDing the components are

1) Use a multimeter to trace the connections on the PCB to find out how the chips are interconnected

2) Disassemble the firmware to find out how to communicate with the chips

if i remember right someone may be willing to help you out with getting the disassembler hardware, but it's gonna take pretty extensive knowledge. once the hardware is known, Rockbox is programmed in C.

i'm not trying to discourage you, but make sure you know this is going to take a lot of work to port, and a whole lot of it will fall to you.

good luck!

I should be able to trace the chips, we'll see about this dissasembler hardware.  I'm assuming we're talking about a device that determines how the chips work?  I'm not sure how to get something like that, but I'm sure I can figure out how to use it.  Now, if this player uses the same main chips as one of the players that Rockbox has  already been developed for, would that make this process a whole lot easier?

Now, I've already opened the player once to see what the hard drive & battery were like.  If there's anyone who was planning on opening it anyways, could you take some initial closeup pictures of the chips/PCB and post links here?  This might help us start figuring out the chips and the possible similarities between this player and some of the ones that have been developed already.  Here's what I did to open it:

Unscrew bottom two screws (#0 phillips worked best for me). Take off bottom. Unplug battery & slide it out using the white flap/tab that is attached to it.  While gripping the metal backing on either side of the unit, slide it towards the bottom of the unit a bit.  At some point, it won't go down any more.  It will leave an opening at the top of the unit of about 3/16 to 1/4 of an inch.  You should at this point be able to lift up the backing, although you may have to slide it to get it just right.  Mine usually gets one side off before the other, but I think it's not a good idea to do it that way-try to get it to let you lift both sides at the same time.

Unscrew all four screws holding the hard drive cage (#0 phillips is fine).  While gently holding the bottom part of the cage from both sides of the hard drive, lift the hard drive cage away from the unit, then jiggle the rest out while trying not to bend it.

The hard drive is glued onto a pad that is glued onto the PCB board.  I carefully (not carefully enough though) took off the black, silver, & clear plastic decoration around the pad & LCD and other than some tabs holding the LCD in place, there is nothing holding the PCB board in general.  I'm assuming the LCD holders should be addressed from the inside of the unit.

After some slight bending, it seems there are more screws underneath the hard drive.  So, I tried gently pulling the hard drive off, which resulted in a warped hard drive PCB. But, the unit still works albeit it having reset the time & such.  Anyone else taking this thing apart may want to be VERY gentle and go VERY slow.  Perhaps one could rotate it a bit back & forth to avoid this probem.

Unscrew the four screws on the PCB. Lift the PCB out of the unit.  Now, you can see some chips, but not all as the controls are on a separate PCB covering some of the chips. To remove the keypad PCB, unsolder the six pins near the top-left-hand side of it.  Small soldering points, so decent to good soldering skills will be needed when putting back together.

The PCBs on this unit are all very thin and I don't want to risk breaking them.

This is all so far, I'll have to get my camera and post pictures tomorrow.  See pics below. 

I'll have to figure out how to make a wiki page for this soon.

[Platin465]

I just saw on another thread that to do this, a player may need to be sacrificed.  If this is not always the case, what determines whether or not it is? 

[Llorean]

Whether you can determine suitably well enough information from it without sacrificing the player.

I mean seriously, someone has to step up and figure out what the hardware is, what the process is for loading other code from disk (whether a bootloader is necessary like in the iRivers, or an appropriately replaced data on the disk like the iPods) and then try to write one.

If enough information can be found out about the hardware and its connections to each other with visual observation, so be it, but it may become necessary to examin the board more closely, or remove components in order to identify them, or trace paths better, etc. Ideally it shouldn't be *necessary* to remove things, but it can become so.

Also, if one doesn't have the means to recover a bricked unit, one can be "sacrificed" by a bootloader that doesn't work, if it must be flashed to do so.

[zsnarl]

I did some diging around and found the firmware. They have it on the chinese site.

http://www.argosy.com.tw/chinese/product-detial.php?prod_id=67

Opening the UPD firmware file, it looks like the MP180 *may* have the following components (or the firmware support these components)

SST39(L/V)F200A
SST39(L/V)F400A
SST39(L/V)F800A
ST-M29W200BT
ST-M29W200BB
ST-M29W400BT     
ST-M29W400BB         
Fujitsu-MBM29LV400TC                                             
Fujitsu-MBM29LV400BC                                                       
MxIC-MX29LV400T                                                               
MxIC-MX29LV400B                                                                       
Sharp-LH28F400BVE-TL85                                                               
Intel-28F800C3TA                                                                       
Intel-28F800C3BA                                                                     
Intel-28F160C3TA                                                                       
Intel-28F160C3BA                                                                   
Intel-28F320C3TA                                                                       
Intel-28F320C3BA                                                                       
Intel-28F640C3TA                                                                       
Intel-28F640C3BA

This list may save us some of the guessing work. Another resource would be the FCC database. I was trying to get internal images of the MP180, but I'm guessing the FCC-ID is inside the MP180. Nevertheless, the FCC's site should have more information as well...

[Platin465]

Ok, I've got pictures & scans.  Most don't look too great though as the scanner couldn't focus on the things not right on the glass, and the camera couldn't  focus on some of the same things.

However, per the list above, mine does have:
SST39(L/V)F800A

The FCC ID on mine is... um... nothing says FCC ID, and it's been a while.  So, here's all the big writing:
RB-10463 Rev1.2, RB-10464 Rev1.2, 051027-120, RT(in an oval) H294V-0 (then, in different font) 0542.

It also has a Motorola DragonBall EZ mc68ez328pu16v 2j83g hhsy0036.  That chip label is hard to read even upon physical inspection.

Also:

PT8406-LQ with a PTC logo in an oval. Has LC40 & TEDT3 below the chip name.

ISSI IS41LV16100A-50T (is that memory?)

Two of these: LVC245A

PL-2505 with this below: LF05402A and this: 001W6A1

Here's some of the clearer pics:

&


Oh, and for anyone taking this appart.  To remove the keypad, unsolder the six pins near the top-left-hand side of it.

I'll put the rest of the pictures on the wiki once I get it going.