A Newbie's Review of Rockbox: First Reactions

[Nymm]

Heard about Rockbox from a friend and decided to try it. I have a 30G iPod Video

ZOMZ. Ughhhh. I'm not liking Rockbox. I'm just too much of a Rockbox newb to truly embrace it.

Problems:

#6. Menus are too complex and take too long to navigate. It's hard to tell where to find things.
#5. Auto installer, Rockbox Utility, is incomplete and won't allow you to import themes during initial setup. That means manual theme setup which = pain in the ass.
#4. Can't customize some of the content. I'd like to delete some of the plugins I could care less about. Like the "metronome" or the crappy calendar that doesn't display the correct dates.
#3. All instructions are in nerdspeak. HELLO. I bought an IPOD. That tells you something about my lack of techno savvy.
#2. Can't customize the menus. No "settings" controlls like for iPod that aloww me to display only the menus I want.
#1. NO. CUSTOMIZABLE. PLAYLISTS. Big fail. Big. Playlists are how I listen to my music. I'm not gonna hen peck, song by song, from 13G of music just to get a que going.

Pros:
Doom. Playable on your iPod. And it comes free, automatically. ONLY reason I haven't removed Rockbox.

What Rockbox needs is an interface like iTunes that allows you to control all your preferences, MAKE PLAYLISTS, download new themes, etc..

Hopefully, there are solutions to my problems and I just haven't found them yet. I think the idea of Rockbox is pretty cool and I want to like it. But it feels a bit over thought. I just wish I could keep it a little simpler and control what features and controls end up on your iPod from your computer.

If any of you know of solutions to any my issues that I have missed (and I fully acknowledge I could have missed some), please let me know.

Many thanks to all the people who have worked so hard on all this! You guys Rock!

[gevaerts]

I'm just going to respond to one or two objective issues and leave the rest to people who like debates :)

#4. Can't customize some of the content. I'd like to delete some of the plugins I could care less about. Like the "metronome" or the crappy calendar that doesn't display the correct dates.

You can delete them. Plugins are plain files on the disk. It won't gain you much space though.

#1. NO. CUSTOMIZABLE. PLAYLISTS. Big fail. Big. Playlists are how I listen to my music. I'm not gonna hen peck, song by song, from 13G of music just to get a que going.

rockbox supports standard m3u playlists.

[Llorean]

6) We welcome a streamlined menu layout, but nobody's ever actually been able to produce one that's better than the existing one, just complain about it.

5) This is a volunteer effort. Feel free to complete the work on the theme site so this feature can be enabled. Until such time as people stop complaining about it and choose to do the work, you're going to be stuck having to do the manual install.

4) Yes, you can delete plugins.

3) You're installing an ALTERNATIVE FIRMWARE. Hello, you may have bought an iPod but replacing the firmware on an embedded device is not "very basic computer use." The terms used in the manual are chosen to be things you can look up if necessary, but be precise and accurate where possible. If they're too complicated for you, maybe you should take a step back and reconsider why you chose to install Rockbox. It's meant for people who want a more advanced MP3 player. That means you're going to have to think occasionally.

2) This is true. This is intentional. As you've noted the menus are complex, and to make providing support easier for it (and maintaining the code itself easier) we chose not to allow menus to be customized. Remember, nobody gets paid anything for this software, so sometimes we're going to take steps to make the job easier on us. If a few button presses more to get to the item you want is really too much of a hassle, you can modify the source yourself to remove the options. If that's something you're unwilling to learn to do, please don't complain about the intentional choices we made, when we're the ones doing the actual work.

1) Playlists work fine. I import playlists from my PC or make playlists on my device all the time.



It may be a "newbie's" review, but it would be polite to take the time to do some learning before complaining, just to make sure you avoid complaining about, for example, features like playlists which are described in the manual.

If you're just installing Rockbox for doom, seriously go back to the Apple software. It's intended to expand the functionality of the devices dramatically. That simply cannot be done and maintain the same level of simplicity as the original firmware.

[Chronon]

Theme installation (extracting an archive to the root of the player) may be a "pain in the ass" to you, but this doesn't really seem like a valid point of complaint when the original firmware doesn't even support themes.

[bluebrother]

unzip -d /media/ipod themefile.zip is a pain?

I'm not sure what you mean about "customizable playlists". You can use playlists just fine, and you can edit them on the go. You can even create your own search in the database and use that to create a playlist.

If this all is too complex for you -- well, then Rockbox simply isn't for you. And if the only reason for not removing Rockbox is doom, well, I don't need to say anything.

[ThaCrip]

well as far as Rockbox's interface...

i think even though it aint super 'pretty', it is professional looking enough and gets straight to the point which i would rather have anyways especially considering Rockbox is just flat out better than the stock firmware because of it's 'options' (i.e. playing alot of audio formats like .ogg etc)

so obviously im going to disagree with the menu's being "too complex and take too long to navigate" part.

as far as manual installation vs automatic... i honestly prefer the manual way since once you know where basic stuff is installed to it's actually pretty easy doing it manually... like updating Rockbox to a newer version etc.

but i do agree with the OP in some area's (i.e. playlists) in the manual don't seem straight forward but once i learned how to use it there overall nice.


but i think at the end of the day Rockbox aint really made for your typical 'average user' , it's more made for the person who wants more out of there player and knows a little bit about computers in general i guess you could say

[Nymm]

Hey, thanks all for the responses. While I'm totally open about the fact that I'm a total newb at this, I have to admit my initial post was sort of a rant. So, sorry 'bout that. I had been all excited about getting Rockbox up and going, so I was a little frustrated when I couldn't "plug and play" as it were. I just thought the whole process would be a little more intuitive. Like I implied earlkier, I bought an iPod originally for it's ease of use, so I've gotten use to the functionality of iTunes.
However, I always kinda wished I could get more out of the thing. After all, I bought it new and paid what for me is a substantial price. So when I heard about Rockbox, I wanted to try it.

i think even though it aint super 'pretty'
Yeah, while I like the idea of refined themes, Rockbox's default looks don't bother me.

(i.e. playing alot of audio formats like .ogg etc)
Rockbox totally wins, granted.

some area's (i.e. playlists) in the manual don't seem straight forward
AMEN

it's more made for the person who wants more out of there player
^Me

and knows a little bit about computers
^Nor me. But close.

unzip -d /media/ipod themefile.zip is a pain?
Yes. I actually only have the vaguest idea what you just said. I'm really more of a drag and drop kinda guy.

This is a volunteer effort. Feel free to complete the work on...
I'm not sure me trying to program anything is such a great idea. I'm better at complaining! (*U*)
No for real. The clock on my VCR is still flashin 12:00. I'm more of a lover than a fighter. More of a geek than a nerd. Seriously, props to you guy who can write script! I can't. I'll leave it to you professionasl. I'm good at graphic design. That's about it.

Yes, you can delete plugins.
How, plox? I tried looking for where they were stored but couldn't identify the file.

That means you're going to have to think occasionally.
Ah, snap.

Playlists work fine. I import playlists from my PC or make playlists on my device all the time.
How? Would love to do this.

...but it would be polite to take the time to do some learning before complaining...
Yeah. I got a bit carried away. But it was a first reaction. Sorry for griping. (._.)

rockbox supports standard m3u playlists.
What is this m3u, you speak of? *googles* And how do I import them to Rockbox?

...if the only reason for not removing Rockbox is doom...
If you're just installing Rockbox for doom
I played with Rockbox a little bit at work and actually enjoyed Jewels and Mazeman more than Doom. ('o')

Once again. Sorry about the tone of my first post. I was just expecting to install and go. Instead, I spent my first twenty minutes trying to figure out how to change the backlighting timer.

I took the iPod to work today and messed around with Rockbox. I got a much better feel for it and admitably, the features are amzing. I don't know how you guys do this in your spare time. The menus and controls steel feel a bit clunky to me, but I think more familiarity will breed proficiency.

I'm still a bit put off by some of the difficulty involved in themes and playlists, but I'll read up some more. Spending a little more time on my iPod today really motivated me to want to figure this all out.

What would be TOTALLY AWESOME would be a Rockbox replacement for iTunes. Something to manage all your song, playlists, plugins, menus, controls, etc., from your compy. If some one came up with that, I would not only use it- I WOULD BUY IT.

[cool_walking_]

Plugins have a ".rock" file extension.  They're located under ".rockbox/rocks/".

M3U is a file format for playlists.  I've never used playlists, but even I've heard of it, so it must be pretty popular.  You don't have to "import" them, just copy-paste onto your device.

[Llorean]

You can also simply delete plugins from within Rockbox by highlighting them, popping open the context menu, and choosing "Delete". If you can find the plugin to launch it, you can find it to remove it.

[bluebrother]

unzip -d /media/ipod themefile.zip is a pain?
Yes. I actually only have the vaguest idea what you just said. I'm really more of a drag and drop kinda guy.

Open the downloaded zip file and drag the contained files (well, it's a folder in fact) to e:\ (or whatever drive letter your Ipod got) too? And why do you need to install themes in the first place? Rockbox comes with a usable theme, and you can't customize the Apple firmware with themes either. So if this is too hard why change it?

Seriously, you don't install any somewhat more complex program and expect it to work without reading up a bit or trying a few things out first. This doesn't work for anything that's more complex like notepad.exe or something similar.

[Chronon]

You can submit patches to the manual without knowing any code.  If you find areas of the manual deficient then this is a good way to contribute (once you have a handle on the ins-and-outs of Rockbox).

Regarding extracting .zip archives to your player, this is straightforward in Windows as well as in the Linux distribution that I use and can be done via a graphical interface if you choose.

Rockbox uses standard .m3u playlists.  Any program that generates such playlists can be used.  Point it to the files on your player (or those in a matching file tree on your PC since Rockbox supports relative paths) and populate a playlist.  This playlist can then be saved to any location on your player and Rockbox will play it by selecting it in the file browser.  Pretty much any music player application that wishes to interact in a standard way supports .m3u playlists (Winamp, Foobar 2000, Amarok, even Windows Media Player, etc.).  Itunes seems rare as a prominent music application that doesn't support this standard format.

Rockbox is a firmware for digital audio players.  It's designed so that you don't need a specialized application to take control of where your files go and how to organize them.  I would certainly not like being shackled to an application like iTunes in order to perform simple tasks like transferring music or creating a playlist.  However, I will point out that Amarok (1.4.10, for example) allows you to manage the music on a Rockbox player and create playlists.  No PC application will allow you to modify the menus.  As has been mentioned, plugins can be removed by deleting them either within Rockbox or from your PC as they are just files on your player's disk.

[AlexP]

In addition to making playlists on your PC, Rockbox allows you to create custom playlists whilst on the go, without the need for a PC.  A long long way from

#1. NO. CUSTOMIZABLE. PLAYLISTS. Big fail. Big. Playlists are how I listen to my music. I'm not gonna hen peck, song by song, from 13G of music just to get a que going.

So, you can create playlists on your PC in any way you want, and then edit them from within Rockbox if you do suddenly want to add a song to your playlist.  Find the song you want to add, open the context menu on it (see the manual), select playlist, then whichever option you want.  Insert last adds it at the end, Insert next adds it next and Insert adds it after the previous one that was added.  Queue does the same thing, except when the song has been played, it removes it from the playlist again.  Pretty damn customisable, certainly compared to itunes and the standard ipod, no?

Anyway, I'm glad you have softened your tone.  Apart from being wrong, your initial post hardly made me feel like I wanted to spend my precious free time trying to help you.

I would also encourage (or even insist) that you read the manual.  Many people have spent a lot of time writing it for a reason.  I'm sure you can imagine how annoying it is when someone turns up and bashes Rockbox for not doing things that it can in fact do, just because they haven't bothered to read the manual.  The manual isn't perfect, but is pretty reasonable, and we always welcome changes, additions, clarifications etc.  As has already been mentioned, Rockbox allows you to do so much more than the original firmware on any of the players (and probably especially ipod) that it is bound to be somewhat more complex.  If you have any suggestions for making the interface more intuitive without losing any of the power we would love to hear them.

[Nymm]

I made some m3u playlists. How do I put them on Rockbox? Is it as simple as placing the files onto my iPod? I tried adding them to the root menu, but it won't take. When ever I try to drag the playlist to the root menu, my iTunes pop up. Then iTunes says its "processing".

[AlexP]

Make sure disk mode is selected in itunes and that then itunes is completely shut, so that your ipod appears just as a hard drive, then just copy them over.  Itunes will try to take over and cock thing up.

[spike66]

Make sure disk mode is selected in itunes and that then itunes is completely shut, so that your ipod appears just as a hard drive, then just copy them over.  Itunes will try to take over and cock thing up.

Also, you can check the "Manually Manage Music" in iTunes (iPod Tab when connected), to avoid automatic sync.

I made some m3u playlists. How do I put them on Rockbox? Is it as simple as placing the files onto my iPod?

Yes, as simple as that.
Also, in case you are interested, there are even ways for converting your iTunes playlists for using them on Rockbox, you may check http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UsefulTools#Playlist_Tools. (*it usually depends on how your files are stored in your PC, though)

I tried adding them to the root menu, but it won't take. When ever I try to drag the playlist to the root menu, my iTunes pop up. Then iTunes says its "processing".

Looks as if you were double-clicking the m3u files (assuming iTunes is your default program for m3u files) instead of just drag'n'dropping.