PlaysForSure = v2? Or just the R-series?

[HockeyBum]

Hi,

I'm looking at picking up a refurb online (buy.com); the model is e260 SDMX4-4096R, and says supports:

"PlaysForSure: This player supports Microsoft PlaysforSure subscription music including MTV's Urge, Rhapsody, Yahoo!, MSN Music, MusicMatch, MusicNow, Napster, Wal-Mart Music Downloads and many more."

Is this another way of saying it's a v2?  Or is this just the R-series that has the Rhapsody etc. support?

I only want to purchase if it's Roxbox-compatible, and don't want the hassle of returning it (though they are good about RMAs and such).

TIA
(Thanks In Advance!)

[LambdaCalculus]

It mentions Rhapsody, so it sounds like an e260R.

Rockbox will work on it, so yes, purchase!

[MarcGuay]

I wouldn't be so quick.  There was someone who seemed to have a v2 with some Rhapsody files included on the player, see here:

http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=14833.0

[LambdaCalculus]

HockeyBum: DON'T buy, yet. Read the forum thread MarcGuay pointed out; it's very important.

[P.Opus]

Just for your information, all E200 series Sansa's support Play For Sure.  Both Rhapsody and Non-Rhapsody models, both V1 and V2 models.  

Also, all E200's support Rhapsody.  However the E200R's and E200 V2's  have tight Rhapsody integration in that they support Rhapsody Channels

So using Play For Sure in a product description field as an indicator for V1 or V2 is not valid.

The most accurate way to tell the difference is in the firmware versions.  1.x.x.x firmware versions are compatible with Rockbox.  3.x.x.x versions are not.

If you can get the vendor to tell you what firmware version is on the device, that would be good.

[bzavala]

I also ordered one of this. Haven't got it yet, but reading the reviews, someone mentioned he installed rockbox on it:

I got one of these for $35 in Dec 07 and I am loving it. It works perfectly for playing music and after loading Rockbox has really become a great investment. I would highly recommend that anyone that gets one of these should go to rockbox-dot-org and research for themselves what this custom firmware can do. It truly opens up the potential of the Sansa and turns it into much more than an mp3 player! Oh and by the way - the chrome "REFURB" lettering comes off of the back with a push from your thumbnail.

I should have it with me this weekend.. hopefully I'll be able to install Rockbox on it as well.

Ben

[HockeyBum]

Guys (all of you) - thanks for the helpful feedback - I'm glad I went ahead and put the question out there.  I will check w/ buy.com to see if they can tell me.  I was hopeful that perhaps the item # might tell us, but I guess not.
Bzvala, PLEASE let us know if what you got was the v2 or not.

It seems as though the v1s are 'going away' and being replaced w/ the v2s, which is unfortunate...I will not own a player that doesn't support RockBox.

[P.Opus]

Ok,  to avoid some of the confusion, let me disperse what I've seen so far.

1.  There are no V2 versions of the Sansa E200R series.  If you have a true E200R, it will be a Version 1 player with a firmware version 1.x.x.x

2.  The easiest way to determine if you have an E200R series is to check three things on the player itself (don't rely on the case, as Sandisk frequently will mis-label refurbed units with the wrong case)
First, Power on the player and see if Rhapsody Channels exist on the main menu.  Second, check the USB modes from the Settings/Mode selection.  The USB modes should be labeled Rhapsody and Play For Sure.  Third, check firmware revision from Settings/Info selection it should be 1.x.x.x
If all three conditions exist, you have an E200R.

3.  There is confusion amongst people on the V2's, In that the V2's have a "Rhapsody" folder, and thus are being confused with E200R's.  The reason for this, is the V2's use a new Rhapsody integration that is coined by Real, as RhapPFS, which is an enhanced Rhapsody integration using Microsoft's Play For Sure DRM.  This is particularly confusing, because a Vanilla V2, which connects to Rhapsody WILL get a Rhapsody Channels screen.  However, just because it has a Rhapsody Channels screen on the main menu does not make it a Sansa Rhapsody.

So to sum things up, there are three types of Sansa E200's, 2 of which are compatible with Rock Box.

1.  Vanilla E200  Version 1.x.x.x firmware, does not support Rhapsody Channels.  Rockbox Compatible
2.  E200R  Version 1.x.x.x firmware, supports Rhapsody Channels.  Rockbox Compatible
3.  Vanilla E200 Version 3.x.x.x firmware, supports Rhapsody Channels. NOT Rockbox Compatible

[Llorean]

Are you 100% sure there's no v2 R? We've had reports of people with players usable with Rhapsody, and a v3 firmware.

[elfion]

k, so the bottom line, true v2s, not rhapsody, the ones who have 3.x version firmware are not supported. i have 2 players on me right now: Vanilla E200 and Vanilla E200v2

the second one looks a little more neat, the wheel feels better. i have to pick one of them today. so is there a point in keeping the v2? will it be supported by rockbox in the nearest future?  

[P.Opus]

Are you 100% sure there's no v2 R? We've had reports of people with players usable with Rhapsody, and a v3 firmware.

Compatibility with Rhapsody does not determine whether or not it is an "R" version of the Sansa.

The vanilla E200 V1 is compatible with Rhapsody in that it can play subscription content from the service like many other Play For Sure compatible devices.  However, the Vanilla E200 V1 does not support the native playback of Real's Helix DRM .rax files, only Microsoft's PFS DRM.  The E200 V1 also does not support the Rhapsody Channels feature.

The E200R supports native playback of the Helix .rax files and was the first player to support Rhapsody Channels, which is like an offline Radio channel with constantly changing content everytime you sync the player.  It was a sort of "proof of concept" player that could natively support both Microsoft Play For Sure DRM protected files and the Helix DRM protected files.

The New E200 V2's support a new initiative by Real called RhapPFS which was first introduced with the Rhapsody Clix Player.  The new Sansa Clip, Sansa View and the E200 V2's support this new RhapPFS service which has the advantage of offering Rhapsody Channels, and tighter integration with the service, but still relies on Microsoft's Play For Sure DRM to protect the content.

One of the key features of the E200R was the appliance decryption key which allowed the entire player to be authorized to play back .rax files without needing to store a "license" file for each and every song.  This allowed E200R's to have much faster and more reliable transfers, and prevented individual tracks from expiring early.

So while the New E200 V2's do support some of the same features that the E200R's supported, like Rhapsody Channels, it's still relies on the use of Microsoft PFS DRM in the background and the use of individual license files for each of the songs.

Users of the E200 V2's, View, and Clip note that while RhapPFS is a better overall experience than the older E200 V1's provided, they are not as reliable as the E200R's.

RhapPFS is superior only in the fact that it can be implemented on most any player with a mere firmware update, where as .rax playback capability needed to be built into the player from the ground up.  As a result, third party manufacturers are much more likely to support the RhapPFS initiative since they do not have to include native .rax playback in their players.

[MarcGuay]

so is there a point in keeping the v2? will it be supported by rockbox in the nearest future?  

If you plan on using Rockbox as your primary firmware I can't think of a reason to keep the v2 (unless that wheel feels really good).