Rockbox General > Rockbox General Discussion
Problems with the TOS
Chronon:
I don't understand your intention in citing that thread. Do you think that I magically know the answer to every question that is asked? I posted some follow up questions that have to do with the installation instructions for that target. And I have absolutely no problem with another user jumping in with an answer. I began as simply another user, like anyone else here.
What is your goal here?
zajacattack:
My goal is to prove that, unlike first shone, average users can be helpful if they are given a chance to contribute, yet they are not given this opportunity in the New Ports thread.
Also, I'm trying to show how the current rules are being abused by the mods as an excuse to correct everyone who doesn't meet their standards.
Finally, Llorean, having an I Agree button does nothing. Do you honestly think that users read the TOS when they register? If they did, would we be in need of all of the corrections by mods?
http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13802.0
Another great example of correction and no help.
http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13697.0
I see a bold statement here from Llorean that seems to imply that most people make mistakes by not listening or reading when this is not the case. It also seems to imply that the mods are always right, and the average users are always messing up 'cause they don't listen.
http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13710.0
A good example by Febs, Here, Febs posted a link to the place in the manual and ended up being very helpful. Unfortunately, this seldom occurs as the classic response is, "Read the manual."
Llorean:
1) The questions wasn't about Rockbox. These are the Rockbox forums. What exactly is so confusing about that?
2) Every time someone has damaged their e200 while attempting to install Rockbox, that I have been involved with, one of those two cases has been true. Have you read every interaction I've had with e200 users, and can you prove this statement false? Because that's ALL I said, despite how you've chosen to interpret it.
3) Yes, it may be better to link directly in the manual. This is debatable: If a user never learns how to find things in the manual themselves, are they more or less likely to be able to search it effectively next time?
And finally: Not reading it is NOT my problem. You claim that we shouldn't enforce the rules because people don't read them? Would it be a problem if nobody ever responded to posts because they just didn't read them?
If something is written, and you agree to it, you are responsible for the fact that you clicked that button. You chose to do it. And if you CHOSE to ignore the text before it, that's YOUR choice, and YOUR problem, not mine frankly. I can't make you read it, but I will assume that you did, and treat you as a responsible adult who takes his word seriously. If you don't believe in taking responsibility for what you do, that's fine. But you seem to be trying to claim that the forum mods are irresponsible, yet at the same time think it's perfectly justified for every non-mod member to be so?
zajacattack:
1) What is so hard about taking a little time to point the user in the right direction(s) rather than just telling him that he shouldn't post here?
2) Your personal experience does not justify you in making that assumption. Perhaps the directions are wrong. For example, in the e200R BL patching section of the wiki, it never addresses what to do if you are NOT prompted to install drivers when connecting in manufacturing mode (which is actually what happens on mine specifically and others computers). Can you blame the user for that? Is it his misreading that is causing that problem?
3) An excellent point. Then, why not start a sticky that explains how to effectively search and point the user to that? Directing someone who is lost is better than just telling him he is lost, wouldn't you say?
4) No, it is unacceptable for one to be irresponsible. However, ASSUMING one is or will be responsible is a problem. ASSUMING one has read the TOS and/or guidelines is a bad idea. ASSUMING leads to unnecessary confusion and scolding by the mods. Also, the mods are sometimes hypocritical. It is OK to say BL (for bootloader), OF (original firmware), mods (moderators), admins (administrators), etc., but when someone says "thx" or "u" or "4", it's the end of the world because they're "breaking the TOS."
saratoga:
--- Quote from: zajacattack on November 27, 2007, 07:33:48 PM ---My goal is to prove that, unlike first shone, average users can be helpful if they are given a chance to contribute, yet they are not given this opportunity in the New Ports thread.
--- End quote ---
You're arguably the most obnoxious and consistently irrelevant poster in that forum though. It'd be one thing if you'd had a few bad posts, but by my count, I ended up deleting something like 30-40 of your posts over the span of months, mostly because they just asked something that had already been explained, didn't ask or say anything, or just plain didn't make sense. Seems to me the problem is you posting in that forum, not us deleting your posts. I'm sorry you don't like it, but deleting contentless posts keeps threads from becoming unreadable.
--- Quote from: zajacattack on November 27, 2007, 07:33:48 PM ---Also, I'm trying to show how the current rules are being abused by the mods as an excuse to correct everyone who doesn't meet their standards.
--- End quote ---
How is correcting things that don't meet commonly agreed on standards abuse? Seems like the opposite to me.
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