Skip Next Song?

[shoe]

What is the point of being able to display the next track on the WPS?  The only reason I can think of, is that if you don't want to hear the next song, you can get ready to skip it when it comes on.  It seems like being able to see the next song isn't very useful without this new proposed feature, yet to display the next track info also adds code complication and bloat, but it was considered important enough to keep in the code.  Why not this change too?

[Llorean]

Well, for one thing there's several other ways to change what you will here next (insert/queue next, play next to replace it entirely, skipping it by hand as the song ends, removing it from the playlist...) so I would challenge your statement that it's "not very useful" without this rather minimal addition.

As well, not all code bloat is equal. The WPS system is extensible, and viewing upcoming music is different from changing it. So you're basing your statement on somewhat fallacious arguments: That both are equally bloaty.

[nls]

I think that an interface that binds 4 different actions to the same button is sort of confusing.
With the double click you would have:

Short click: skip to next track
Held down: seek
Short click, short click: remove next track from playlist
Short click, long click: skip to next directory (if applicable)

IMO that is too many.

[yegods]

Short click: skip to next track
Held down: seek
Short click, short click: remove next track from playlist
Short click, long click: skip to next directory (if applicable)

IMO that is too many.

you may be right.  but you could also argue that three actions is too many also.  or even two.  it all depends on the comfort level of the person using the interface with multiple different button presses.  if this were to go into the rockbox product software, i would say it should be at least be user configurable.

[Llorean]

Rockbox is NOT a product. We state this frequently in these boards.

And the controls are intentionally not configurable, for a variety of reasons. If you disagree with this, you can come to the IRC channel and debate with the many people who feel they shouldn't be.

Two controls (tap vs hold) is almost certainly acceptable in most cases. I do feel that the existing short-long one causes some user difficulty (skipping a song, and then seeking in the next song for example, especially problematic with audiobooks: "Oh, this was the chapter before, I'm halfway through the NEXT one...") but adding two different double click actions (especially if someone's simply trying to skip two track) brings the controls from "a bit difficult" well into "unwieldy for casual users."

[shoe]

It could be put in the WPS Context Menu, or assigned to SELECT in the Quick Menu (only if a track is currently being played).  That would avoid the double-click worries.

[Wrathernaut]

Good point on "why are you looking at your player and not the road" but by that argument, why have text display at all on it? It certainly doesn't take me but a fraction of a second to read the 2-3 words for the next song. Factor in the 3-4min avg length of a song, and there's bound to be a stop light to bump the next song the required number of times. Besides that, there's always the voice-activated, text-to-to speech device commonly installed in my passenger seat, whose searching algorithm usually coincides with my preferences.

The non-tactile controls on the gigabeat make for 1 action per "button zone" problematic at times, especially when the player is acting a little laggy.

I'm in the process of getting the code and such, and will probably just work on a "Gigabeat Car Build" as there seems to be a lot of differences in controls that work well for different situations.

To throw my $0.02 into the customizable keys, it seems to me that if you're savvy enough to have rockbox, you're savvy enough to handle nonstandard keys.

[Llorean]

it seems to me that if you're savvy enough to have rockbox, you're savvy enough to handle nonstandard keys.

Believe me when I say there is no phrase or grouping of words in the English language that can possibly explain how far off base I think this statement is, having spent the last two years or so fielding Rockbox support questions.

The controls need to be consistent, and lean toward at least moderately user friendly (I think they aren't quite user friendly enough, but we don't get many people accidentally skipping directories, so it's not a big problem).

As to "why display text at all," surely you don't think that MP3 players are only ever used while driving? But if you're citing the stoplight example, I can easily remove songs from the playlist. And in fact, if I have the voice functionality enabled, I can remove songs from the playlist without ever looking at my player: Far safer than having to read the screen at all, even just to determine what's next.

[AlexP]

To throw my $0.02 into the customizable keys, it seems to me that if you're savvy enough to have rockbox, you're savvy enough to handle nonstandard keys.

Hahahahahaha /wipes tear from eye

You would think so wouldn't you, but no.  Maybe we make installation too easy.

[Wrathernaut]

To throw my $0.02 into the customizable keys, it seems to me that if you're savvy enough to have rockbox, you're savvy enough to handle nonstandard keys.

Hahahahahaha /wipes tear from eye

You would think so wouldn't you, but no.  Maybe we make installation too easy.

Sorry, I wasn't clear in my wording on that. If you can handle putting rockbox on, you can handle there to be an option for an alternate keymap somewhere in the options.

I will definitely concede that having a "rockbox" standard layout for all players is important and necessary. However, I'd like to be able to change the keys that aren't rockbox standard keys to do what I want.

[AlexP]

That would be a support nightmare and isn't going to happen.

[polygonal]

Sorry, I wasn't clear in my wording on that. If you can handle putting rockbox on, you can handle there to be an option for an alternate keymap somewhere in the options.

I will definitely concede that having a "rockbox" standard layout for all players is important and necessary. However, I'd like to be able to change the keys that aren't rockbox standard keys to do what I want.

Well I think if you think yourself savvy enough you should be able modify the source code yourself (take a look at apps/keymaps/keymap-yourtarget.c, it is very easy to do) and compile your own build. Having options for key customization is really option bloat beside a support nightmare.

[Wrathernaut]

I will do that.

Every time I try to get away from programming it creeps back up on me...

[shoe]

I posted a patch on the tracker that removes the next track from current playlist using SELECT from the Quick Menu (for ipods)

http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7820