Rockbox "Experts" are jerks

[xxebbandflowxx]

Ok, i'm new here... like yesterday new... but i have been part of other forums for quite some time...

the first thing i noticed while going through a few threads is how jerky some of you helpful "rockbox experts" can be... i understand how annoying it can be to answer the same question over and over, especially if the question could be answered with a little research... but you don't have to be so arrogant about it... most of these people are just excited to use the product and are not very tech savvy...

i have been an IT Technician for 3 years and i completely sympathize with how frustrating people can be... but you don't have to be a dick about it...

Ok, I'm ready... lets hear how wrong i am, or how i don't know what i'm talking about, and blah blah blah blah... all i know is that i have seen at least 7 or 8 threads just this morning that had comments from you guys that sucked... maybe i jumped to a conclusion, maybe its not always like this, or maybe its just a couple of you guys... i dunno, let me know...

[bascule]

You'll find that this is an extremely moderated forum, much more so than any other I've come across.

There are well written and well signposted forum rules plus (unlike many other open source projects) an extremely comprehensive and well-written manual available for all targets.

The aim is to encourage people to use these resources rather than the freely-given time of the board members which would be better used in coding, updating the Wiki, answering questions not covered by the documentation or discussing Rockbox topics.

... most of these people are just excited to use the product and are not very tech savvy...

So how do they go about living the rest of their life? Do they decide to go bungee jumping by tying elastic bands together and jumping off a bridge in the hope that if it doesn't work someone will sort them out?
I really struggle to understand people who would replace the firmware on their precious music player without, it seems, even a cursory glance at the documentation to evaluate the risks and benefits.

[DefineByte]

most of these people are just excited to use the product and are not very tech savvy...

Rockbox probably isn't for them at this point. It hasn't even had a full release on most targets yet.

[xxebbandflowxx]

i totally see that and respect it... i guess my major problem has been with comments that seem to attack the questioner... like "maybe if you weren't so..." and "why don't you try >condescending remark<..."

please don't take this as an overall statement for you guys... alot of you seem really cool, like that whole "DevConPub" thing that happen last night... gosh, i would have loved to have gone and have myself a few pints... the jerkiness seems to be a tad more prevalent here than most places... i dunno, maybe i haven't been here long enough to make a proper statement...

[LambdaCalculus]

i have been an IT Technician for 3 years and i completely sympathize with how frustrating people can be... but you don't have to be a dick about it...

Then do you want to try and deal with these kids that install Rockbox just because they hear about playing Game Boy games on their iPods? Do you want to hear repeated requests of "gimme t3h gameboy r0mZ!!"? Well, do you?

You should know that repeated stupid questions WILL make you disgruntled. I'm in IT myself, and I can't STAND hearing some of the ludicrous questions people ask. We hear people who come in who sound like they mistake their CD-ROM tray for a cup holder asking questions that happen to be well documented in the manual, as well as about every other place on the site.

Like the other guys said before me, we have to waste time answering silly questions, when we can actually be doing some research to help spread Rockbox further.

[bluebrother]

most of these people are just excited to use the product and are not very tech savvy...

Rockbox is not a product. It's a project, and it hasn't even been released for any other player than the archos ones. And as it is an open source project there are no warranties, and noone has the right for support. We could do it similar to other projects with about no support -- but I don't think this would be better in any way. Instead, we require users doing their homework and some amount of thinking themselves:

If someone comes around and replaces a firmware he should do some investigation first and get to know differences and common errors, i.e. read the documentation and FAQs. Quite a lot users coming in here, having installed Rockbox just for playing doom. That's not the purpose of Rockbox, and why should someone in this forum help about this if people are not willing to even read the documentation first?

[Bagder]

And for the record, being a jerk isn't always bad. It actually sometimes make people go read the manual! ;-)

[DefineByte]

Remove the pre-compiled downloads and close the unsupported builds board. Should sift out most of the detritus.

I kid of course. >.>

[xxebbandflowxx]

Then do you want to try and deal with these kids that install Rockbox just because they hear about playing Game Boy games on their iPods? Do you want to hear repeated requests of "gimme t3h gameboy r0mZ!!"? Well, do you?

spoken like a true tech   no sir, as atractive as that sounds, i'll leave you to it!... this is a much better response than i had hoped for, at least you guys realize it  ... i'm seriously cracking up over here... and i have totally changed my opinion... you guys are doing an awesome job, keep up the disgruntled work!  

YOU GUYS ROCK....err...um... like some... sort of... box?

[magnumforce2006]

I do agree with the sentiment that some of the experts come across as somewhat (and in some cases VERY) condescending, but the bottom line is that unless you become a developer or an expert, you really are only using a project that you have no influence or power on.

I don't use rockbox for the forum mods or experts though, I use it because it's good  

[GodEater]

I like to think that most of us old hands try not to actually be condescending to people. It *does* get to the point sometimes when I really want to shout at someone who's posted here with the same dumb thing I've seen posted here 20 times before - but I try to self police when that happens - and when I find myself getting a shorter and shorter fuse, I simply stop posting at all. Give myself about 2 weeks to calm down again - and then try to get back into it again.

That being said - there are some who practically deserve to have jerks talk to them. As has already been said - we seem to get a regular influx of users who aren't interested in Rockbox's primary purpose, and who also aren't interested in anyone but themselves it seems. We have, for example, posting guidelines about using proper English (as well as you are able of course - we're not expecting non-native English people to come in sounding like an Oxford Literary Professor) because one of Rockbox's main features, it's voice navigation, is aimed at people with limited or no sight. Those people use software to read our forums, and the usual AOL degeneration into plzkthxbye confuses that software, and makes the forum illegible. I've seen several instances where people have chosed to ignore the rule on using proper English in the first place, and then, when asked politely to refrain from doing it again, respond with "jeez, get a life u losers! this is the intarnet!". Those people are damn lucky I'm not a forum mod because I'd be very tempted to ban them on the spot.

People who come to the forums who look like they've actually read the posting guidelines, have at least attempted to read the manual, and maybe even searched existing posts have the right to expect courteous help however - and I try hard to provide that where I'm able.

[dan_a]

To be honest, I've always been impressed with how polite, courteous and helpful the people with the "Expert" tag are.  Yes, I have seen them get frustrated, but this is mainly with people who are refusing to follow the troubleshooting steps that they are being asked to take.

[xwaydoublecode1234.rez]

On russian forumboards people usually get *read only* or get banned for such topics without any explantation...

[rdtyphn]

i have been using rockbox/reading these boards for years, and i agree that sometimes a few experts come off as extremely condescending. the only reason i visit some subforums nowadays is to see the interesting ways in which experts will shoot down poorly written requests for help or criticize any challenges to the status quo.  of course, these experts are great and they devote their free time to policing these boards but at the same time there are things they seem to relish.

[GuitarRocker2562]

You guys are total jerks, but I like that, I think people should read the manual and you gouys made me learn how to compile and add patches on my own, thanks you guys! (Esp. Llorean, lol)